Question about my HPDE Insutructor?

[rppngears91]

Hey guys. I am wondering if my HPDE instructor was a little ignorant. During my first session there were a few times when I turned in a little late, apex incorrectly, braked to early, ect... my instructor would start literally screaming "What the fuck is wrong with you, what is your problem?" Now I can understand an insutrcutor acting like this if I was constantly off line, apex incorrectly. I just thought it was uneccarsary for him to do that, he also might have been doing that because of my younger age (19). Is this how instructors usually are? If so then I can deal with it I was in the Marine Corps, Id just rather try learning with out someone screaming and yelling at me.

[Lucid Moments]

I've had two different instructors and neither was anything like that. They told me when I was off line, but were nice about it.

[mcmmotorsports]

Talk to Chris about it and see if they can match you up with a different instructor. You are paying good money for an enjoyable experience, don't let someone ruin it for you.

[berny2435]

I've had an instructor point out with dissapointment that I missed a apex or braked to early but that is fine with me as long as he is not YELLING at me. My instructor appologized for getting so into the moment but then explained that he enjoyed being pushed while he was learning the ropes and I concured that most of the time I need someone to jump on me if I'm doing something wrong.

 

Then again, we were just in grp II hpde, not a racing school. Before hand I did tell my instructor that I was looking forward to getting my license to race HC nasa. That may have sparked his motive to push me a little harder than a normal grp II student.

 

At one point in my lil Honda we caught up to a 82' 911 turbo around the track. He was pushin me pretty hard to stay on his arse and get into position to pass. At times I failed to keep up and he let me know what I did wrong. I liked that, but some may not. We ended up passing the 911. HPDE is not racing, I know that, and most of the time I am a lil shy of riding peoples butts even when I know I am faster.

 

I'm not sure of your intensions, but I would make sure you tell your instructor what you are looking for out of the event. This should clear things up before hand so you both know what to do and expect from eachother.

[Bruce L.]

from your description, it sounds like the instructor needs a refresher in adult teaching style. This is supposed to be a positive experience, and isn't boot camp.

 

Tell the chief instructor at the school, they always want to find out ways to improve the school.

cheers,

bruce

[ExRacer]

rppngears91, under no circumstances is it OK to belittle anyone in the NASA HPDE program. If this guy was having a bad day, there it is, but it is your repsonsibility to report how the dude made you feel and request another instructor. As an HPDE Group leader and racer, this kind of behavior is unacceptable and doesn't get NASA any points.

 

Without reporting this and being mature about it, the program doesn't improve. With your military background, I applaud your restraint.

 

Next time, just pull into the hot pits, thank the gentleman for his time and re-enter the pregrid and request another instructor until you find a match. There is a wide range of abilities and techniques and getting the right hookup sometimes takes a little "frog kissin'".

 

It's so worth it when you get someone you can relate to and that has the proper experience and technique. After all, this is what NASA is all about.

 

See ya on the starting line, buddy!

[rppngears91]

I wish I knew this before my track event!! I thought that it might have been a "hazing" kind of thing. I kind of feel like I wasted 300 dollars for nothing. I also asked my fellow student how there instructors were, and they said thier instructors were explaining why things were they were, such as turn in point, the proper apex and such things. I feel like I have picked nothing up from my first track event. If I had know I could switch instructors I would have in a heart beat. I thought they were a set amount of instructors for the HPDE groups. Well thanks guys I hope my next event goes over better!!!

[scion tcx]

gears, I'm sorry you felt like you wasted some time, but for me this is really valuable -- I'll know what to do on my first day if I have a similar experience.

 

Small consolation, but I'm glad this topic was discussed.

[berny2435]

do NASA events have you fill out documentation at the end of the event with misc questions regarding the event, the instructor and etc?

 

I know BMW club of Kansas City has this

Porsche Club of KC doesn't

 

This isn't saying that all BMW and Porsche Clubs do this.. .

 

I just wish I would have started a lob book earlier and got signitures from instructors each time. I can't remember for the life of me what my Last instructors name was. Races in AI with a 2000 red cobra though. Documentation, doc and doc again.

[ExRacer]

People, make sure that you get your Passport signed at the end of every event. I know it's a pain and we're all tired and ready to go home, but it is of vital importance to future sessions that we get a feeling for how you performed and as this case shows, if someone was not cutting it. Your instructor should be talking to you about what you did right and what you need to improve on. Also we need to be honest with the assessments so you can focus on the areas that need improvement.

 

rppngears, get with your HPDE Director and let them know who this guy was. You didn't waste your money 'cause you were ontrack, but you should again follow through with the feedback to isolate this incident.

 

You're from MD so I guess that you should contact

 

Chris Cobetto

16431 Kelli Ashley Ct.

Montpelier, VA 23192

804-883-7669 Phone

[email protected]

 

Good luck and don't give up! NASA is the very best at this HPDE thing and we want you to improve. Hell, we need the next gen of racers 'cause some of us are gettin' too old for this #4!!.

 

I'm going to Cal Speedway in a week or two and teach a whole bunch of HPDE guys the fast line. Wish you were there! YEEEhah!

 

Later . . .

[99HOSS]

Chris is the director of the whole show, the Chief Instructor is Jeff Curtis. He'd love to hear from ya.

 

You did fill out your class and instructor eval at the end of the event, right?

[Declan]

Sorry to hear you had a bad experience, I hope the next track event will be more enjoyable.

I'm going to run my first NASA HPDE in Fontucky in March and judging from the NASA folks I have met so far it should be a lot of fun.

I was building a car to run in SCCA but I got to see my first AI race last year at California speedway and after meeting a few of the racers and chatting to Peder, Andy and John I realized NASA was the place for me.

 

The car is finally almost finished thanks to the help of Paul Broun, Corey Webber and his crew (AIX racers all) so I cant wait to hit the track and see if I can still remember how to drive the thing.

 

ExRacer, can you show an old, slow Irish fella the fast line?

[ExRacer]

Declan, it would be my pleasure . . .

[Gfaules]

Hey guys. I am wondering if my HPDE instructor was a little ignorant. During my first session there were a few times when I turned in a little late, apex incorrectly, braked to early, ect... my instructor would start literally screaming "What the foo-fiddily-diddily is wrong with you, what is your problem?" Now I can understand an insutrcutor acting like this if I was constantly off line, apex incorrectly. I just thought it was uneccarsary for him to do that, he also might have been doing that because of my younger age (19). Is this how instructors usually are? If so then I can deal with it I was in the Marine Corps, Id just rather try learning with out someone screaming and yelling at me.

 

I am appalled. This is exactly what should never take place regardless of the situation and one more reason why the mentor program would be perfect for your needs. It is important to point out that at times there will be newbies who feel as if they are not "clicking" with the instructor they get hooked up with and that's perfectly acceptable. Equally important is that they need to know IT'S ABSOLUTELY ALRIGHT TO ASK FOR ANOTHER INSTRUCTOR.

 

On the other side of the coin it's important for instructors to realize a teacher can teach better when they learn how to get a student to ask questions instead of forcing them into some sort of submissiveness. What kind of bullshit is that!

 

NASA wants everyone's experience to be educational as well as exciting and fun and nobody should have to put up with someone's inability to stay in control. Speaking as a businessman, if one of my employees does something wrong and my customers don't say something, then I can't fix the problem. In turn, other customers may suffer the same misfortune as you did. Send me a private e-mail or contact me thru the national office when you have time and let's take care of this post haste.

 

Gary Faules

NASA Mentor Director

[VKZ24]

There is absolutely no excuse for this type of behavior from any instructor. You should definitely contact Jeff Curtis and let him know about it. He would welcome your input to ensure this doesn’t happen again to you or anyone else.

 

It is unfortunate that you didn’t know (most don’t) that you can request a different instructor. Sometime peoples personalities conflict with one another and just don’t mesh well. That doesn’t excuse what you are describing here though. In the future talk to Dan Unkefer of Jeff Curtis and they will take care of it for you.

 

Please do not let this unfortunate occurrence discourage you from coming back to another NASA event. I can assure you that that kind of behavior is not the norm, as NASA is an extremely professional organization.

 

Hope to see you back out there soon!

[rrrracer]

I'm just spectating here but let's not forget that there are two sides to every story... not saying the OP is wrong, but you can't lynch the instructor based on one post.

 

There may be more to it than we know. I've been with NASA in various positions over the last five years and this is the first I've heard of anything of this nature. Just my .02

[AllZWay]

I have had many different instructors and I have had some AWESOME ones and some "not so much", but even the bad ones still have something you can learn from.

 

The biggest problem I ever had was with an instructor used to driving a much lighter, slower car with bigger brakes.

 

He and I actually argued over a line of a corner and just why my car couldn't do what he was asking. Finally, I turned my car over to him and said "prove it". After his attempt... he finally admitted he was wrong and we never had another problem, but prior to this I almost requested a new instructor.

 

BTW...this was not a NASA instructor, but from another group.

[rppngears91]

Anyone who is reading this post dont misinterpret please, I have NO problem what so ever with being corrected when I have made a mistake/error, but the manner in which my instructor corrected me was just TOTALY innopropriate in my opinion. I dont completly hold it against my instructor (we all have our days!!). I was just making sure that this occurrence was not a "hazing phase" or a "right of passage" as Marines like to call it haha. Now that I look back on the weekend I really regret not confronting the instructor or telling a NASA director. And for those wondering I did NOT honestly fill out the survey I recieved because I was under the impression my instructor would actually be reading through the survey. I will be be going back at the end of March for another HPDE, and I cannot wait!

[99HOSS]

I'll probably be there as well.

 

We probably met in passing this past week-end, as I was helping Dan with some of the classes and probably handed you your 'track pass' at some point.

 

Don't feel bad about filling out a survey form honestly. The instructor is given the opportunity to read them if they so desire. Did he go over your eval form for the course as well as your 'Passport' when the event was over?

 

I've sent you a PM.

[mcolangelo2005]

I was just making sure that this occurrence was not a "hazing phase" or a "right of passage" as Marines like to call it haha.

 

ACTUALLY....NASA does have a right of passage for new drivers. It's a time-honored tradition and involves buying a round of beer for your instructor AND fellow HPDE students.

 

It's even in the NASA CCR!

[rrrracer]

rppngears91, glad to hear that your isolated experience has not diminished your enthusiasm! Rest assured that your next NASA experience will be a good one!

[sscguy]

rppn, in the future if this happens, I'd suggest going to your instructor first about it. We try to read how our students would like to be instructed, but sometimes get it wrong. I found out (unfortunately at the end of the weekend) that my HPDE1 student wanted to be pushed harder. I had planned on stepping everything up a notch or two on Sunday anyway, but it would've been beneficial to us both to have been more communicative with each other. From his end, I might've come off as too laid back or something, whereas from my end, I thought HE wanted to be more laid back.

 

Similarly, I had an instructor years ago at Summit Point with me during a rain day. He wasn't mean, but was definitely pretty blunt. I remember screwing up the carroussel and he said, "well, you sure fucked that up," but he then proceeded to explain what I had done wrong. He took that extra step in being critical to make sure it was an educational experience, rather than just a mean-spirited one, and it worked for me.

 

It may be a little intimidating, especially if the guy is acting as you're describing, but I think that'd be the best option for everyone, as then the instructor knows what he's doing wrong and you'll either get a different method of schooling from him, or a new guy in the car with you.

 

Edit: We have the damn expletive-editing tool on HERE now too? Man, whatever happened to free speech?

Edited February 27, 2007 by Guest

[Chris Cobetto]

Wow. That is NOT cool at all. Please let me know who the instructor was so that we can council him. Please email me privately at [email protected]

 

I really appreciate the feedback. We do our best to make sure everyone feels welcome and feels that they have gotten what they were expecting. Nobody likes being yelled at.

 

Thanks for playing with NASA!!!

 

 

Peace,

Chris

[UnderPSI]

My first event is coming up and after reading this thread, among A LOT of great advice this struck me the most.

 

Next time, just pull into the hot pits, thank the gentleman for his time and re-enter the pregrid and request another instructor until you find a match.

 

Thanks for that excellent advice, it will be remembered should I need it.

[Mr PS]

So basically the "Simon Cowell" type of instructor with the foo-fiddily-diddily syndrome.