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V8VENOM

'07 Lotus Exige S...

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V8VENOM

Just picked one up and was thinking of doing some TT. Noticed classification is TTA * (+7 points I think).

 

If I use Exige Cup Car parts do I need to add points? Technically these are factory parts and I didn't see Exige Cup Car listed. Also, same with tires, the very sticky race tires are "factory" parts and even specifically made for Lotus.

 

Also, there is a pully and ECU kit that will bring HP upto same level as Cup Car -- what point hit will this take and how do you folk enforce ECU upgrades (they look identical)?

 

Also, shouldn't we get some type of point reduction for being prudent buyers seeing as Exige S is about 1/3 - 1/5 the cost of other TTA cars.

 

Rob.

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kbrew8991

does the base model Exige S have it? (if the answer is no, take the points... but you can also upgrade beyond that to nicer stuff for the same points). And you'll need to take your licks for the tires as well, you guys get such a massive width credit I don't want to hear any whining about getting dinged for factory tires

 

ECUs are simple enough to check as well.. they have methods for this

 

with the costs of a used Z06 hitting sub $20k if you shop well, I don't think the $50-60k new Lotus wins the cost wars in TTA either

 

TTF is the class where you get credit for budget (or at least I wish we did.. heh)

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phoenixR34

I'm pretty sure you could build a bundle of fast TTA cars for cheaper than an Exige.

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V8VENOM

"you could build" -- think that is the key and I would agree. But you folks have started the Exige S in TTA* in bone stock fully street legal form.

 

If you can find a C6 Z06 (500 HP variant) for $20K please tell me where -- I was looking at those before I got the Exige S and couldn't find one for under $75K.

 

If you're talking about the older Z06, well comparing older car price with a new car price isn't really a fair comparison. In addition, the Exige S lap time potential is significantly better for modifications applied -- you don't need to add much HP to Exige S to make it's HP/weight ratio drastically change. On the Z06 you'll hit the wall of diminishing returns pretty early on.

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phoenixR34

Your point was the Exige is 1/3rd to 1/5th the price of most TTA cars. I don't know where you run, but I don't see many $220,000 TTA cars in my region!

 

Frankly, while the Exige is a dynamite car I'm sure, you could probably build a 240SX or E36 BMW for $20,000 and net the same result.

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kbrew8991

the C5 Z06 is the car to have for TTA, like it or not

 

the C6 Z06 gets dropped into TTS stock I thought, due to the 8.7:1 adjusted cutoff for TTA. They dyno about 450-460whp bone stock which means you'd have to add ALOT of ballast to get under that mark...

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phoenixR34
the C5 Z06 is the car to have for TTA, like it or not

 

the C6 Z06 gets dropped into TTS stock I thought, due to the 8.7:1 adjusted cutoff for TTA. They dyno about 450-460whp bone stock which means you'd have to add ALOT of ballast to get under that mark...

 

3400lbs (let's be nice) / 460 = 7.3:1. Not even TTS!

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V8VENOM

Many TTA cars listed in the rules are the high dollar Porsche and Ferrari -- that's where the 1/3 to 1/5 cost came in.

 

Sounds like a good opportunity for a C5 Z06 to Exige S shoot out - stock for stock (meaning no tire changes and no brake upgrades)

 

8.7 is the limit? Geez, an simple exhaust upgrade alone drops the Exige S to 2008 lbs / 235 bhp 8.5 (only a 15 bhp increase) -- do the rules state HP at the wheels? Are dyno runs required for TT? Sounds like the TT rules have changed a lot since '04 -- back then I just got a gold medal for being fastest in class -- you folks are gettin' serious!

 

I had an street legal STi that I ran in TTB (back in '04) 1:56 at Infineon and 2:03 at Thunderhill -- yeah STi realy is an easy car to go fast in and make go faster. Having owned both I don't think the STi is much of a match againts my Exige S in the dry.

 

I agree, one can build a Datsun 510 to go faster for less.

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Sad Arthur

Hrrmmm. Black Bob is turning those times in TTD these days. I guess things HAVE changed in TTB since '04.

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V8VENOM

And Pink Sally ran 10 seconds faster in TTF...

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Sad Arthur

dbl post. sorry.

Edited by Guest

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Sad Arthur
And Pink Sally ran 10 seconds faster in TTF...

 

I guess you haven't seen the latest time sheets. Check your email. Bob's best time for the weekend at Sears was a 1:56.3.

 

Sa-mokin'

 

burnout.gif

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V8VENOM

What config was T7 setup as? And how much traffic did he have to navigate? And what tires did he use?

 

I had a lot of traffic and T7 was the extended (all the way out and cut back) on street legal Yokohamas. And this was in my STi, no idea what my Exige S can do.

 

That reminds me, has TT changed much or does NASA still send them out with Group 4 HPDE free for all? I think TT is a great idea, but it's hard to evaluate because (back in '04) if the event was packed, traffic was always an issue. I know other organizations would actually stagger TT based on driver lap times and you'd get 1 warm up, 1 hot, 1 cool down lap.

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kbrew8991
8.7 is the limit? Geez, an simple exhaust upgrade alone drops the Exige S to 2008 lbs / 235 bhp 8.5 (only a 15 bhp increase) -- do the rules state HP at the wheels? Are dyno runs required for TT? Sounds like the TT rules have changed a lot since '04

 

its whp and weight with driver, safety gear, etc.

 

the biggest changes have been at the top (TTR, U, S and A) with this adjusted power:weight concept.

 

things have changed largely for the better to ensure good close competition at Nationals

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kbrew8991
That reminds me, has TT changed much or does NASA still send them out with Group 4 HPDE free for all? I think TT is a great idea, but it's hard to evaluate because (back in '04) if the event was packed, traffic was always an issue. I know other organizations would actually stagger TT based on driver lap times and you'd get 1 warm up, 1 hot, 1 cool down lap.

 

depends on the region still, SE will split TT to its own group if there are enough entries to warrant it, and MA always splits it... not sure about anyone else

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Sad Arthur
What config was T7 setup as?

maybe , what? 30 yards between apexes? something like that.

 

And how much traffic did he have to navigate?

 

very little as explained below

And what tires did he use?

 

I think he was on Hoosier DOT R compounds, but it may have been Toyos

I had a lot of traffic and T7 was the extended (all the way out and cut back) on street legal Yokohamas. And this was in my STi, no idea what my Exige S can do.

 

That reminds me, has TT changed much or does NASA still send them out with Group 4 HPDE free for all?

 

Many changes for the good, I think. NorCal TT is one of the largest TT groups in the country. We run in our own group. First session doesn't count for the day but your time sets your position on the grid for the next session. Session 2 runs the same way so by session 3, most everyone is divided by their lap times and most everyone will get clear laps. There will still be some overtaking of course, as some folks stay the same, some times come down, and the fast guys can lap the slowest ones, but by and large there is plenty of open track. Since I've been in TT, I've dropped 5 seconds from the fastest time I ever ran in HPDE 4, so the system works. Great bunch of guys. We all look forward to seeing you out on the track again.

 

Your car (actually a shiny black Lotus Sport Exige Cup) is my wet dream.

 

 

2005-Lotus-Sport-Exige.jpg

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V8VENOM

I believe that is the cup car, this is my Exige S:

 

http://www.nocomsleft.com/graphics/lotusE5.jpg

http://www.nocomsleft.com/graphics/lotusE1.jpg

http://www.nocomsleft.com/graphics/lotusE2.jpg

 

But it does generate an amazing amount of downforce at speed, kinda weird actually, never driven a car doesn't get light at speed.

 

Debating whether I should install a better SC or go with the Turbo.

 

Sounds like TT has changed much over the past 3 years.

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Sad Arthur

Ummm yes, that'll do nicely. I'm sure you'll need someone to demonstrate its capabilities on track, since you're so rusty.

 

 

 

Personally, I like the instant on feature of a supercharger and prefer the SC whine to the whoosh of a wastegate.

 

My car has a 1.6 liter supercharged Chrysler 4 banger that puts out 210 HP. They've just come out with a turbocharged Peugeot-Citroen engine for it, but word on the downlow is they are breaking crankshafts dealing with the torque. Brand new clean sheet engine; gotta expect some problems.

 

See you at the track.

 

Cheers,

SA

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V8VENOM

Rusty? Ha ha -- I'm at Infineon 3 times a month and usually spend at least 4 hrs on track (the Kart track -- 125cc shifter finished 3rd in championship last year).

 

The Exige S is basically a two seater Kart -- no rust here.

 

The shifts still produce that blow off valve pssssh sound on the Exige S even at only 7.3 psi. But this Arqray exhaust I just installed makes it harder to hear as the car sounds more F1 like at 8,500 -- and has some nice gurggle and pops. From what I've heard the Lotus/Toyota 1.8 is pretty solid but an accusump is highly recommended for track duty. There is a simple kit out already which I plan to install regardless.

 

There is a pully and ECU coming out that I'd also like to install -- more basic bolt on stuff that will bring the Exige S back to Cup Car bhp level.

 

There's also a sequential shifter that will convert H pattern ($2800) http://www.sector111.com/handler.cfm?cat_id=20219&cat_id=20446&prod_id=1420&function=product which does not appear to take an TT rules hits. But I don't know the Exige S tranny well enough yet to know if this thing is worth it.

 

SC definitely better for quality of exhaust sound and not as hard on the motor, but Turbo rules the day for power output.

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smack_evo

 

There is a pully and ECU coming out that I'd also like to install -- more basic bolt on stuff that will bring the Exige S back to Cup Car bhp level.

 

There's also a sequential shifter that will convert H pattern ($2800) http://www.sector111.com/handler.cfm?cat_id=20219&cat_id=20446&prod_id=1420&function=product which does not appear to take an TT rules hits. But I don't know the Exige S tranny well enough yet to know if this thing is worth it.

 

wouldn't think points on the shifter would matter too much once you throw that

pulley and ecu on the car. the +20 points you collect right there will bump you out of tta.

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V8VENOM

wonder if removing the rear view mirror and visors counts as weight reduction?

 

http://www.nocomsleft.com/Graphics/LotusESMirror1.jpg

 

-- 3 parts that really just block ones forward vision. maybe I can add the cat to offset?

 

Seeing as the Exige S starts life in TTA +7 points someone obviously feels its an unfair advantage.

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kbrew8991

you're on crack if you're not using the alternate weight reduction method (or you've got a screwy car)

 

take the weight of the driver out points-free? yes please!

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phoenixR34

 

Seeing as the Exige S starts life in TTA +7 points someone obviously feels its an unfair advantage.

 

yeah.. starts out in TTA*, but you get 28 points back if you run stock width tires. So you essentially have 35 points in modifications for free.

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V8VENOM

Confused? What are you talking about?

 

http://www.nocomsleft.com/Graphics/LotusFrontWheel.jpg

http://www.nocomsleft.com/Graphics/LotusRearWheel.jpg

 

These are Exige S stock tire so not sure what you mean by OEM? 195/50-16 60 treadwear and 225/45-17 60 treadwear -- this is a street tire and what comes on the Exige S.

 

If I take a tire penalty, it would be with Hoosier R6 -- the front size would be different only because hoosier don't make a 195/50-16 R6. I don't see much of a benefit going wider tire with my current HP levels -- I'd have to run some tire temp tests to see if current widths are not adequate.

 

I'd prefer to see how the stock tires do. For sure the Hoosiers offer considerably more grip -- but I'd need to learn how to setup the suspension to maximize that tire. The car is currently running at "street" ride height 130mm f/r -- it can be adjusted considerably lower but Lotus don't recommend dropping it more than about 10mm however I don't think 20mm would cause any issues with geometry -- adjustable front sway bar should be able to dial in a good balance and then just play with damper adjustments per track condition.

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smack_evo

yeah.. starts out in TTA*, but you get 28 points back if you run stock width tires. So you essentially have 35 points in modifications for free.

 

19 points based on the largest tire on the car but yeah that's still one hell of a freebee. it sounds like the only way to stop this car is on the hp/lb ratio

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