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h4 class oddball... Want to run d15 non vtec in ef dx civic


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Posted

Ok, so Ive looked at the rulebook enthusiastically for months, used the search tool on this forum, and basically googled myself to death.

 

I dont know if I should look for a good car to buy, or if I should run what I have.

 

What I have is an 89 dx shell, a d15, a newer (96) d-series non vtec head with a stock 91 si cam, and a brand new 91 SI tranny w/ lsd. (stock final drive)

 

How would this be classified? I want to be able to run H4 at 1900 lbs.

 

Would that mean that I would have to keep the dx tranny, cam, and injection??

 

The engine mod section had very little info about head prep, or head swapping, and I was confused by some of the related materials. (concerning backdating and component swapping, etc.)

 

Also, What do DX guys do for brakes? Can I swap on OE type discs?

 

What about h4/5 suspension prep... anything goes as long as its single tube?

 

Ive never been to an event so i don't really know how stock these cars really are.(im near seattle, and the NWHC page has NOT been updated in over a year)

 

I know I am getting in over my head, but how far will I be in it if I want to say, have a top half finish occasionally and call it a good day?

 

Are we talking stock suspensions with performance shocks, or are we talking unlimited aftermarket suspension options and cryo disc treatments on h5 class cars making 110hp...

Posted
Ok, so Ive looked at the rulebook enthusiastically for months, used the search tool on this forum, and basically googled myself to death.

 

I dont know if I should look for a good car to buy, or if I should run what I have.

 

What I have is an 89 dx shell, a d15, a newer (96) d-series non vtec head with a stock 91 si cam, and a brand new 91 SI tranny w/ lsd. (stock final drive)

 

 

a few things

 

1. That isn't legal for H4. No way shape or form.

 

2. If you want to run an 89 civic at 1900lbs in H4 your ONLY option is to run a 88-91 civic, with a DX motor,tranny (you can ONLY ran the DX motor that came in a 1988-1991 Honda Civic DX), and brakes. that is your only option for that.

 

3. You didn't read enough, the first page says, "if the rules don't say you can do it, then you can't". SO if the rules don't mention something you can't do it. No head swapping, no 4 angle valve job, no aftermarket/different cam.

 

What about h4/5 suspension prep... anything goes as long as its single tube?

 

Ive never been to an event so i don't really know how stock these cars really are.(im near seattle, and the NWHC page has NOT been updated in over a year)

 

I know I am getting in over my head, but how far will I be in it if I want to say, have a top half finish occasionally and call it a good day?

 

Are we talking stock suspensions with performance shocks, or are we talking unlimited aftermarket suspension options and cryo disc treatments on h5 class cars making 110hp...

 

 

Suspension prep range. Some guys run 500 dollar koni yellows or tokicos. Others run $4,000 Koni 2812 double adjustable. Sway bars are range from 300 for both, up to some guys running $500 rear sway bar and $150 on the front.

 

If you haven't been out to the track, then you are pretty behind the 8ball, so to speak. Were you finish is completly dependent on who you run with. I am not sure who runs h4 up there any more. The only person i knew who ran up there recently sold everything.

Posted

hmm. Yeah i read that part at the beginning of the rules, but i figured since it was a stock head it was like for like... Plus compression increase would not exceed the .5 allowed by the rules, and its a factory 91 cam. It should be a fun car in any case. We're going for some good dragstrip numbers out of a D15.

 

The lack of a 2008 HC schedule for my region (plus the lack of a reserved date at Pacific) suggests that it no longer exists. I agree that without being able to attend an event, I am sorta screwed. This summer we plan on attending races in the norcal region to get a feel for it all.

 

All really we are looking for is a car that can be marginally competitive with a decent driver, at a track he knows well. We dont want to be fighting for last and breaking things because we were ill prepared.

 

Since the H4 rules seem to be rather constricting to a builder, (at least enginewise)would our shop be better off simply purchasing a car, and then improving/replacing from there? To be perfectly honest, there arent a lot of examples of road racing success up here to emulate, so we are kinda lost. Everyone here thinks they are a drifter.

Posted

Can a 1900 lb dx even BE a viable competitor in H4?

 

I mean the weight advantage would hardly seem to make up for the weak engine/tranny combo. I guess much of it would be made up through a modified final drive ratio, and improved handling/tire wear correct?

 

How do people cope with drum brakes? Does everyone swap to SI discs?

Posted

buying pre-built, or having some one who knows what they are doing build you a road race car are the best options.

 

 

You want cheap, but want to be able to fuss with the engine, in road racing those two things do not go together.

 

 

There are still guys up there running, go over to http://www.roadrace-autox.com and make a post about HC racers in the northwest, i know at least 3 or 4 of them post on that site.

Posted

wow, cool. Maybe i can volunteer to update their website...

 

Yeah its looking like maybe this season drag racings going to be the cheap way to go.

Posted
How do people cope with drum brakes? Does everyone swap to SI discs?

 

In H3-H5 the brakes must be stock, and since the '88-'91 Civics only came with rear drums than that is what you'll need to keep. There are several people that run CRX's (which are able to do the rear swap since the '90-'91 Si's came with rear discs) that still choose to run the rear drums since they are lighter than the rear disc setup and there is no real performance advantage between the two.

 

Regards,

 

Sam

Posted

anyone know where i can find a decent runner for sale?

 

And i mean decent, no cr ap boxes.

Posted

Yes, that is my old car that I drove for over 2 years when I first started racing. It is a great car to learn how to race in as it teaches you the importance of momentum, which is a must when you've only got around 90hp.

 

The car is great on consumables, a set of front pads will last a full season and a set of tires can make it thru most if not all of a season.

 

I'd highly recommend this car to anyone who is just starting out.

 

Regards,

 

Sam

Posted

well, we are really looking at drag racing this summer, as a lot of what we will need to be competitive will be similar. If we started putting something together ourselves, it may not be a competent road racer by season's end, but it'll be a way competitive drag racer.

 

speaking of which we found a 4.9 final drive locally for 200$

 

We are thinking that a 4.9 final ratio tranny would make sense to get even if we did just drag race this summer, and it could be put to good use in a road race application later.

 

We were looking at a complete progress revalvable suspension, with stock size front and rear roll bars, as well as skunk 2 pro ef upper arms in front and a king motorsports rear camber kit (http://www.kingmotorsports.com/category.aspx?cat=40" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;) and a full poly bushing set.

 

Any opinions here?

 

We already have a stock radiator and a 2100 cfm hardwired fan, and both engine oil and transmission oil coolers in addition to the tranny.

 

Could something along these lines be competitive in h4/5?

 

Is there a race car building 101 post somewhere I could reference?

 

Im way interested in that old car of yours btw... Just one thing... i need to be able to get it street legal to drive to the track and to special events. I know it has no title, but thats just a roadbump... our state requires a 6 mo waiting period for someone to bring in a title and claim it, but then its cool.

 

But our shop doesnt roll in trailers. well, maybe our tools do...

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