no-control Posted March 18, 2008 Posted March 18, 2008 I've heard a few good arguments for the B20 but I've heard the B16 with the R cams is another great option. Anybody care to weigh in on this? Quote
slammed_93_hatch Posted March 18, 2008 Posted March 18, 2008 it is to early to really tell, the motors just haven't had development in the form they will run in in H2. With the exception being the b18a/b, as i don't think the IM is going to make huge differences. I would be really careful about using that as a judge. The person driving the car should be/is why the car/motor combo is winning. On paper the b18/20 looks to be strong. But it owuld be interesting to see a full IT type build on a b16a plus the other allowed mods. The motor was a back marker in ITS, and every else has been heavily modified. So really to early to tell IMO. Quote
Redstone Posted March 18, 2008 Posted March 18, 2008 we choose to build our car with a japanese B16A. They are cheap and ton's of them around. We tossed some ITR cams, intake manifold and throttle body on there and it makes pretty decent power. dyno's 154whp @ Blacktrax (dynapack, reads low compared to dynojet) Each car/engine combo will take a different driving style and approach. The B16 is fast, but you have to keep it up in the revs, because below 6000 its gutless. You must maintain your corner speed and get a good exit, otherwise the bigger 1.8 and 2.0l B-series engine's catch up! I think the B18C5's are gonna be slower because of their heavy min weight of 2500 lbs. the cheap b16's and b18/b20's are gonna have a slight disadvantage due to weight quite a bit less. i can't wait too see how the year is going to pan out in h2. it looks like a good competitive class. Quote
0x1 Posted March 19, 2008 Posted March 19, 2008 Keep in mind that when you talk hp vs torque and higher weight/hp vs lower weight/hp, it is very track dependent which setup will be fastest. I think that both motors have the ability to be better on specific tracks than the other. I'm betting on the B20 being faster for our tracks here in AZ. I'd bet it would also work better at Cal Speedway and possibly Infineon. I think Buttonwillow is a toss up and WS and T-hill would likely favor the B16. At tracks like WS or MMP, a heavier setup with more horsepower (like ITR in H2) might actually be faster than a lighter setup with the same weight to hp ratio. Like Jimmy said though, it's going to primarily come down to the driver and the rest of the car prep. I guess only time will tell once good drivers in good cars start building these things to the limit of the rules. Quote
ekim952522000 Posted March 19, 2008 Posted March 19, 2008 Tuff one I think the gsr will be good because you get type R cams still and you get a weight break from the B18C5 I think the GSR will me a nice middle ground between power and weight. and it should make 95% of the power of a type R. Quote
AustinG Posted March 19, 2008 Posted March 19, 2008 A conservatively tuned B18C5 should put out ~190-195 whp and ~130-135 ft/lbs of torque with stock cams, head, intake manifold, and bottom end, with a rev limit of ~9,100 rpm. It's all dependent upon the vehicle, and how much the engine is built to the H2 specs. The above numbers are from my street B18C5 engine, with a cat, header, intake, mugen headgasket, hondata intake manifold gasket and a Hondata tune. Quote
no-control Posted March 19, 2008 Author Posted March 19, 2008 B18c5 is out of the question. I think paying $5k for it is just gross. If I was willing to spend that kind of coin I'd either run H1 or AI I think the gsr will be good because you get type R cams still and you get a weight break How is this legal? I thought the GSR had to keep stock cams? getting back on track I was keeping this between the 20 & 16 for cost. These are the 2 cheapest swaps. I'm thinking the B20 is the more forgiving engine for this rookie Quote
AustinG Posted March 19, 2008 Posted March 19, 2008 B18c5 is out of the question. I think paying $5k for it is just gross. If I was willing to spend that kind of coin I'd either run H1 or AI I think the gsr will be good because you get type R cams still and you get a weight break How is this legal? I thought the GSR had to keep stock cams? getting back on track I was keeping this between the 20 & 16 for cost. These are the 2 cheapest swaps. I'm thinking the B20 is the more forgiving engine for this rookie As per the HC rule set for H2: All Honda/Acura All B18C1 OEM Cam, OEM ITR or Blox “ITR” Style Manifold Allowed 11.1:1 2400 Looks like they have to have the stock B18C1 cams installed. Quote
slammed_93_hatch Posted March 19, 2008 Posted March 19, 2008 An important thing to remember is this isn't drag racing. Power is only part of the game. Weight kills EVERYTHING, acceleration, braking, and lateral grip. I REALLY REALLY love the low HP, low TQ, and low weight combo. It is really easy on equipment, as you just weigh less, and i like the challenge. Within reason of course, IMO the SOHC motors are just out of the question for H1 and H2. I tend to have a more open mind then scott on the motors and tracks. Because of the open-ness of the tranny rules in H2 every one can be on the same playing field, sort of. A b16 simply needs a 4.9FD and a bumped rev limiter and that motor will be GREAT. That same tranny with the stock FD is great on the B20 and LS. And for the b18c the 4.7 is great, some really like it for the b18/20 also. Quote
jmeris Posted March 19, 2008 Posted March 19, 2008 Tuff one I think the gsr will be good because you get type R cams still and you get a weight break from the B18C5 I think the GSR will me a nice middle ground between power and weight. and it should make 95% of the power of a type R. I don't think the Type R cams are allowed with the B18C1 (unless there was an addendum to the rules that I haven't read, which is HIGHLY possible.) However, OEM cams with a "Type R" Style manifold or Blox manifold IS allowed. jmeris Quote
ekim952522000 Posted March 19, 2008 Posted March 19, 2008 Whoops misread that you guys are right. Quote
Redstone Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 i agree with Jimmy on the low hp/low tq and low weight. definetly the setup id prefer for h2! Quote
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