2005 rules-open up AIX?

[kurtborton]

My main point is the exhaust running through the fire wall:

 

7.3 Frame The entire tub, floor pan, firewall, and frame assemremain in the stock position and cannothe factory between the firewall and base ofloor within the body or lower the body below the frame rails. The only modifications tallowed will be in the following instances:

e) For exhaust clearance. This does not allow exhaust components to be run is not allowed

 

As far as I understand the rules, you should be able to mount control arms, shocks, etc...to the cage. I suppose I really made that statement mainly because I've heard several times people tell me that it can't be done....I'm just looking for some clarification here on this one.

[Grizlbits]

But these cars will still instantly make nearly every other AIX car uncompetitive. Changing the rules so that existing cars are suddenly uncompetitive is not the way to keep people in the series....

I don't think the WC cars from 5 years ago, maybe even 3 years ago are the problem. I would welcome those cars. It is the WC cars of today that will show up a year or two down the road (especially if I can find one cheap ) that will kick the butts of all who are currently running. 2:14 lap times at Road America is near Trans-Am times. It will put my car down 11 seconds a lap, and I consider my car currently competitive.

 

As far as I understand the rules, you should be able to mount control arms, shocks, etc...to the cage. I suppose I really made that statement mainly because I've heard several times people tell me that it can't be done....I'm just looking for some clarification here on this one.

 

Kurt, my upper 3rd link goes to the cage to a bar I added behind the seat. Rear suspension (3rd link anyway) seems to be free. I don't know if the front has other restrictions that the rear does not Mounting to the cage - if properly built- is probably safer anyway. Just try and find somewhere solid to mount a suspension component in a Mustang , you may as well hold the component with your hands.

[racercosmo]

Chris, a few times on here, or maybe the Yahoo list, people have asked about mounting suspension to the rollcage and have been told no by either Ryan, JWL, or Peder.

I'm not staing an opinion one way or the other, just reporting the news.

[Gene Borton]

We were one of the teams that was told no about mounting things off the cage. I didn't see it in the rules, but we did what the powers told us.

 

Now the other guys did the opposite and asked to change or break a rule specifically written telling you that you can not do (frame rail notching). I wanted to notch the rear frame rails on my car, but we didn't. Can I notch them now?

[Monroe]

Sean,

 

ASC9099 is not my real name. I'd feel like an idiot if my parents named me that. That is two of the numbers that my cars run under in ASC. My actual REAL name is Steve R. Carvajal, and I 'm one of the directors for the ASC series this year. .

 

Steve, welcome.

 

I'm Monroe and I own LG's chassis #3.

 

You are right about not having many places to run these cars.

 

I'm not running this year due to a health setback and costs. (so much for the wealthy ex WC racer myth )

 

My old hoopty runs a low compression, hyd roller, pump gas motor with an old Ford truck transmission behind it. It is as low tech as a stone door stop. Weight is more than a light AIX's right now despite using some of the original fiberglass and CF. My car makes 440 at the rubber and is in no danger of embarrassing a strong AIX car.

[ASC9099]

Monroe,

 

You and I talked on the phone years ago about that chassis that Lou had behind his shop. Did you finally get it finished?

[Monroe]

I remember the conversation. In hindsight, I should have written you the check and been done with it. I would have spent less.

 

The car has been a challenge. Very steep learning curve maintaining it and learning to drive it. I managed to win the COMMA Series GT1 Class in 2003 in it. Due more to my perseverance than talent I'm certain.

 

I'd sure like to run with the NASA folks.

 

I hope it works out.

 

Monroe

[tacovini]

The fact is, at most tracks, World Challenge cars are somewhere around 5 seconds per lap faster than the fastest AIX cars.

 

World Challenge drivers and World Challenge sponsorships are what make World Challenge cars go 5 seconds per lap faster.

 

I think most of the ex-WC cars NASA is considering would be driven by 2nd owner privateers like you and me who just wanna race and have fun.

 

Open up AIX!!!

 

-=- Todd

 

(Posted as a racer and not as a director.)

[ASC9099]

As most of you know, there is a big difference between running in WC and running in AIX. (although my personal experience is only limited to a few WC classes with the Mustang and running SU with SCCA...). Most of the top guns in WC are running with factory support, or like Boris Said, running with Bob McGraw's support in the AER car. (I haven't seen that car this year...). To the weekend racers, very few would be able to run near the times that WC are running, plus you have to remember that WC is running a 335/35/18 Toyo RA/1 rear tire and at least a 295/35/28 RA/1 front tire. I'm not totally familiar with the AIX rules, but I don't think those size tires are allowed, are they? That will have a huge difference inthe times the cars turn, no matter who is driving.

 

However, on an different note, if you really want to have a competitive, cost effective, dependable purpose built race car that runs in a stable series, try the ASC series. Total cost of a turn key competitive car can be as low as $25,000. That car will be competitive without a rebuild, (unless you screw the pooch...), for two seasons. Total cost of a race weekend averages between $1250 to $2500 for everything, depending on crew and expenses. THAT"S TOUGH TO BEAT! AND YOU HAVE 15 PLUS ASC CARS IN EVERY RACE!

[racercosmo]

Steve, the AIX rules state you can run an 11" wheel with maximum 335 tire. I'm not familiar with a D.O.T. tire wider than 335, so that point is moot. If the tire rule was opened up to allow slicks, I'm sure you'd see at least one Mustang on 345 Hoosiers.

[Grizlbits]

I'm sure you'd see at least one Mustang on 345 Hoosiers.

 

Make that 2 Mustangs. I already run slicks (used) in another series I run now.

 

We are currently running 305-35-18 Front / 335-30-18 DOT rears here in Ohio Indiana. (at least 3 of us- Myself, Gene, Jeremy)

[tacovini]

Where are the "old" Saleen-Allen Rrrrr cars anyway??

 

I haven't seen any of those since Saleen raced them in the 90's. Not sure if they'd be AIX legal but would love to see one run with us. Anyone know if any privateers own one now???

 

I think they had 2 versions. The 550 HP Daytona 24hr cars and the lower HP GT cars. Anyone have any current info on them?

 

-=- Todd

[mwilson7]

I know the owner of one of the cars and I think it's pretty safe to say that it will never drive another competitive lap while he owns it.

[Bryan Shugg]

I don't have a vested interest in AIX, but I like the idea of requiring a certain front nose % for ex-WC and other hairy arse cars. The weight management on these types is a large competitve advantage.

 

I also like the provisional basis for 2005 idea. If they come out and clearly dominate, perhaps other steps can be taken.

[Monroe]

I know the owner of one of the cars and I think it's pretty safe to say that it will never drive another competitive lap while he owns it.

 

That is a damn shame.

[racercosmo]

I understand that Texas doesn't have many/any AIX cars running. If that is the case, why not let Monroe run his car? It's another car on the track that adds to the show and it's one more driver who gets to have fun. If somebody shows up, talk it out adn let him decide how he feels about it. Yes, these are national rules, but if one region allows a car to run that's slightly out of spec, it won't hurt anybody else. Yes, if we ever have a national race, he might not be let run, but we'll deal with that when it comes up.

[JKnight]

J.R. Smith ran his AIX Camaro for a few races last year in the West, despite having headers that went through the firewall. He wasn't able to be in the points contention, but it's another car in the mix (and a Camaro at that).

 

I agree with Cosmo.

 

Jason

[Monroe]

J.R. Smith ran his AIX Camaro for a few races last year in the West. He wasn't able to be in the points contention..............

 

Jason

 

There is the rub. If I spring for the car, carrier, time and consumables, I want to be counted when the times are tallied up. Otherwise it is just a DE event.

 

Without points on the line there is no reason to drive a defensive line or to run the car hard. All you're doing is getting seat time.

 

Provosional with reward weight as required makes the most sense to me. I don't want an unfair advantage.

 

Monroe

[Admiral]

I agree with Cosmo's thought entirely. I'd prefer a ruling at the national level allowing the ex-WC cars into AIX but I don't run in that class so I really don't have a say in the matter. We had exactly 1 (one) car run AIX with us in 2004, that driver came down from Omaha, Nebraska when we were at Hallett in Tulsa. He only ran that one event with the TX region. He was a nice guy too, I'd be willing to bet he would have run AIX with Monroe no problems had we allowed the WC car into AIX earlier.

 

If there are no AIX cars in a particular region, then this shouldn't be hard, right? Unless it complicated some national item like a contingency program or some run-off event where multiple regions participated.......

[racercosmo]

Monroe, that is my thought. It should be up to the region. We all know that things are bigger in Texas.

[Adam Ginsberg]

Regardless of what decision is made, it should be a national one.

 

We need to keep ALL the regions on the same sheet of music. Doing so helps maintain the focus, the momentum, and the clarity of the series.

 

IMO, former WC cars should be allowed into AIX. Some restrictions would likely be in order, but allow them a place to run.

[onralz]

Why wouldn't it be as simple as changing the min weight for ex WC cars? We've all seen what happens to their times when a couple hundred pounds are added on. Make their minimum weight around 3300 and don't put any limits on how much ballast they can add as some of these cars are signinficantly lighter than that.

Monroe is a stand up guy. If there is a guy to work with on this to help add the WC cars to the class, he's the one.

[Grizlbits]

I agree that the older WC cars should be let in, but it may take more than weight to equalize the new (within the last 2 years) WC and the AIX cars. I don't think you can add enough weight to todays WC cars to loose 5 seconds a lap. It may need some tire adjustments also. I will point out again that the AUDI's ran a 2:14, a Corvette ran a 2:15 at Road America this year. I don't think current AIX cars will run under 2:22.

 

Another point: If you let WC cars in, then do you let ALL Corvettes, Vipers, Porsches, Audi's, BMW's in? I think you would have to, to be fair. Now the Mustang & Camaro will be slaughtered. Center of gravity, aero, and rigidity of the Corvette alone will make my car uncompetative.

 

Here comes that slippery slope again.

[JKnight]

Another point: If you let WC cars in, then do you let ALL Corvettes, Vipers, Porsches, Audi's, BMW's in? I think you would have to, to be fair. Now the Mustang & Camaro will be slaughtered. Center of gravity, aero, and rigidity of the Corvette alone will make my car uncompetative.

 

This is still American Iron. Corvettes and Vipers aren't V8 Sedans, and Porsches, Audis, and BMWs aren't American Iron.

 

Jason

[onralz]

What did John Young run this year at Road America?

Chris you are probably right. It might take more than that but it was just something to start at.