Jump to content
Balroks

HMS May Event - let the Bench racing begin

Recommended Posts

Balroks

So who's doing what officially?

 

I'll be there in HPDE3, looking to finally check out, once I remember how to drive a stick

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gators2001

PTA

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
TurboShortBus

TTD...hopefully, I'm not the lone gunman again. If only Steve's POS Bimmer 335i didn't overheat and go into limp-home mode after a lap and a half like they all do, we could have a little fun. And Billy needs to stop doing pro bono work and start billing some bitches so he can get back on track!

 

Mark

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
obzezzed350

Hoping to be there in HPDE3 to get my checkout as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32EVOIX

I will be there in TTA and my brother in TTS, as usual, get your check rides on Saturday so perhaps you can qualify to TT on Sunday. If you are planning to do that, make sure you bring two copies of your classification forms. And gentlemen make sure they are correct please, if you have any questions, there are a bunch of people that can help you come and find Mark or me if you like.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32EVOIX
So who's doing what officially?

 

I'll be there in HPDE3, looking to finally check out, once I remember how to drive a stick

 

When is the last time you drove?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Balroks

Sh*t, June '08 I think?

 

Technically ATM, the car weighs more then 3000 with me in it, so the cage that's in it isn't legal because it's 1.5/.120, if they can bypass that, that and there's also no way for me to get a dyno sheet beforehand. My plans are to go by AWD motorsports and get some dieting done, then some E85 bits, and tune on everything once we find out the weight. Which will be awhile still me thinks. At the very least I can rent a transponder and see the lap times on sunday if I get HPDE4.

 

What's the test like? This is a red flag, this is a meatball flag, this is how to pass in corners?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
TurboShortBus

I think the current requirement for TT is to spend a minimum of 2 days in HPDE-4.

 

If you would like, we can go over your classification forms at the track to make sure your points add up properly. I really want to avoid "points surprises" like we had last year. You can find me doing HPDE tech in the mornings, and I usually pit in the garage next to the tech lanes.

 

Roll cages aren't required for TT, so I think you will be fine with a 1.5" OD cage in a 3000+ lb car (but don't quote me on that). However, it is still illegal for W2W.

 

Per TT Rules Section 6.1.2:

 

It is not a requirement for all drivers to submit Dyno testing results, or for that matter, to have their vehicles Dyno tested before competition. However, each driver/owner is responsible for ensuring that the vehicle is compliant with the above "Adjusted" weight/power restrictions.

 

With that being said, the TT policy is still "honor among thieves."

 

I haven't had a chance to have mine dyno tested, and while I should be able to do it before late May, I would be shocked if my car does better than 14.25:1.

 

Mark

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32EVOIX

Balroks,

 

Let me further clarify. There is no dyno requirement for classes TTA-TTG, however, this year each class has a hp/wt requirement each class must meet. From what I have seen so far this is not an issue and the only class that comes close is TTA (they have the same hp/wt ration as TTS). If for example someone protests a TTA car they can request a dyno sheet or they can put you on a dyno for tech if they so choose. Now the Evo IX minimum weight classification is 3263 lbs, anything less than that you have to take points. You do your sheet normally and if your points for the modifications exceed 39 you would be in TTS, (base classification for the car is TTB). At this point, you would have to complete a different classification sheet for the TTS, TTU, TTR cars that is strictly based on hp/wt with a few other stipulations, which affect that ratio. In addition if you are TTS, or TTU you must submit a dyno sheet with your classification form, if you do not you are automatically placed in TTR. Lastly, as Mark stated there is no cage requirement in TT, and your advancement to TT would be predicated on your driving and experience level. Naturally, you must fist pass the check ride into HPDE 4. Just a small reminder that HPDE 4 runs with the TT group, there are cars competing and passing is naturally allowed anywhere on the track, situational awareness is paramount here as there are some very fast cars out there going 10/10th’s and they do not like to be held up. I hope this helps.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Balroks

Yup yup, I've read that form a few times . I'm sitting pretty right now at about 8.55 I think with my crap tune if I had to guess. Forgot TT didn't require a cage, although I think it's pretty crazy NOT to have one, esp since yes, everyone's trying for 10/10. But ya there's no way I can do TTA, points or weight wise We'll break it down when i'm there. Also will Nix's bring extra transponders for regular HPDE4's? I know it's not classed but times are times, just for improvement/comparison........bragging sake

 

Edit: Or borrow someone's Traqmate

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
TurboShortBus

Transponders are BYOT, so make your own arrangements. Team BDR used to rent them out, but I think they are racing with other organizations now.

 

You will not be scored in the results if you are in HPDE-4, although there's nothing stopping you from bringing your own Traqmate or Longacre Hot Lap setup.

 

Mark

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Balroks

Right but If I bring my own, it'll still be posted at the track, just not on mylaps right?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
dapaspy

I'm coming as a spectator. Will miss Saturday but should be there on Sunday. It will be my first time out so I hope to meet most of you guys.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
TurboShortBus
Right but If I bring my own, it'll still be posted at the track, just not on mylaps right?

Check with Barbara and Steve for that. I'm not sure if the insurance will have something to say about NASA providing timing in HPDE-4, since it is still DE and not a timed competition.

 

Mark

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Balroks

Cool, I remember SE region offered it at their events so i'll check. So anyways, I'm hoping for some 1.37's by the end of the weekend

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32EVOIX

Don't know how it would work if you are not running TT but Billy Stacy has Transponders for rent but you better get a hold of him soon they go fast.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32EVOIX
I'm sitting pretty right now at about 8.55 I think with my crap tune if I had to guess.

 

Sitting pretty? I am not trying to be rude here nor burst your bubble just trying to help; I know that you have put an enormous amount of effort into the car not to mention a lot of money. So here is my two cents, if you are at 8.55:1 you are at the low end of TTU, you are going to get smoked when you run TT. The idea is to maximize your hp/wt ratio. For example, 8.66 would be perfect for TTS (being you can round up in favor of the competitor 8.7) for TTU you would have to be at 5.46 (5.5) to be perfect. I would add weight if I were you to get to 3263 lbs and detune to get to TTS. Doing some general math (assuming you run 275-255 DOT tires), you would need to be at 389 hp to the wheels maximum at the weight stated above. To compete in TTU you would need 627 hp at the wheels, at the same weight. Now unless you have an AMS level built car I would seriously consider TTS. This is why Evo’s can only go so far and you do not see them racing too much in the higher hp classes. I am quite sure the racing class would be either ST, or SU. Oh and one other thing, you best forget those Nittos, or BF’s and bring a set of Hoosiers to the party as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Balroks
I'm sitting pretty right now at about 8.55 I think with my crap tune if I had to guess.

 

Sitting pretty? I am not trying to be rude here nor burst your bubble just trying to help; I know that you have put an enormous amount of effort into the car not to mention a lot of money. So here is my two cents, if you are at 8.55:1 you are at the low end of TTU, you are going to get smoked when you run TT. The idea is to maximize your hp/wt ratio. For example, 8.66 would be perfect for TTS (being you can round up in favor of the competitor 8.7) for TTU you would have to be at 5.46 (5.5) to be perfect. I would add weight if I were you to get to 3263 lbs and detune to get to TTS. Doing some general math (assuming you run 275-255 DOT tires), you would need to be at 389 hp to the wheels maximum at the weight stated above. To compete in TTU you would need 627 hp at the wheels, at the same weight. Now unless you have an AMS level built car I would seriously consider TTS. This is why Evo’s can only go so far and you do not see them racing too much in the higher hp classes. I am quite sure the racing class would be either ST, or SU. Oh and one other thing, you best forget those Nittos, or BF’s and bring a set of Hoosiers to the party as well.

 

LoL, yes dude I know, mayhaps I misled you with "pretty", ya'll don't know me well yet so I shouldn't expect you to get my humor I apologize for the confusion, please allow me to clarify:

 

- I'm not looking to TT this weekend, or next, or the next.

- At the most i'd like to get HPDE4, and only because i'd either get timed unofficially (maybe), and get to lap with you guys.

- I'm not TTing at 8.55, i'm not that insane lol, the car is maybe 10% towards my endgame.

- I might as well drive a lawnmower in TTU in current config

- Also I got BF's and Nitto's because they last - for DE's only.

- H's tires are expensive, no sense in wasting them when I'm relearning the car and remembering the track

- I'll start build threads when I get along the lines like our friend with the Z did.

 

So, back to bench racing everyone. I gotta get up early, smoking my famous babyback's for some friends tomorrow. Three things I love in life:

 

1. babyback_ribs.jpg

2. guinness.jpg

3. 2791294730304.jpg

 

Cheers,

 

Matt B.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32EVOIX

Matt,

 

We would love to have you running with us but you scared me there for a minute. I thought to myself, this guy has spent so much time and money and the car does not fit to be competitive anywhere WTF. That is a good plan to learn the car and believe me TT or not we are always going to have fun. I do have a question though, what are the plans for the build? Are you going to build one of those Time Attack monsters? As you know, I have been anxious to see the final product.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Balroks

Haha, sorry about that. Time and money will tell bro. TA monster i'm not sure about. However a lasting, endurance, w2w winner is the major goal. Since the engine's mostly stock sides bolt on's, she makes about 360 @25psi on its current tune. So I've got a lot of fat to loose first because of the cage, i'd rather lighten this pig up also because it's SO much easier to turn, stop, everything, it makes it feel like a video game with the AWD - and the acceleration with just that power is insane. I get this from an AutoX evo friend who's got that sumbish down to 2300 freakin pounds. It feels like 700hp in every gear. Bueller on Evom and I have about the exact same idea going. So i've gotta get the mechanical weight lost (emissions junk, rails, extra wiring, lightweight replacement drivetrain parts etc), see where I am, then do the aero, re-weigh again, THEN work on turning the boost down, or just do a build - at the weight range (say 2700+) I should only need 450-550ish for TTU, and somehow get down to 290-320 for TTS. I think I'm also gonna have Anthony do me a Tin dash with the whole RalliArt or something stamped in also

 

I do have a question on the cage though now that I think about it, is it >3000lbs bare weight? Or with driver, fuel, and everything?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
TurboShortBus
I do have a question on the cage though now that I think about it, is it >3000lbs bare weight? Or with driver, fuel, and everything?

Well, what good would a 1.5" cage be for a <3000 empty racecar when it weighs 3300 lbs with a driver and fuel once it hits the track? Think about it...

 

Mark

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Balroks
I do have a question on the cage though now that I think about it, is it >3000lbs bare weight? Or with driver, fuel, and everything?

Well, what good would a 1.5" cage be for a <3000 empty racecar when it weighs 3300 lbs with a driver and fuel once it hits the track? Think about it...

 

Mark

 

Good point Mark, so What good is no cage like 90% of the field runs at 10/10ths, stock seat, stock belts, no hans, no firesuit once they hit the track? The car's designed for sub 3k with driver and fuel, engineered from the beginning since before I took the first panel off. I know you prefer to go one above "recomm" so that's cool.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
kbrew8991

bold & underline added for emphasis - page 63 and 64 of 2009 CCRs (which you should ALWAYS look at before asking a question )

 

For the purposes of determining roll bar tubing sizes, vehicle weight is as raced, but

without fuel and driver. Note: There is an allowance of minus 0.010 inches on all tubing

thicknesses. Minimum tubing size for the roll cage is:

Up to 1500 lbs.

1.375” x 0.095” Chrome-moly / Seamless mild steel (DOM)

 

1501 - 2500 lbs.

1.500” x 0.095” Chrome-moly / Seamless mild steel (DOM)

1.500” x 0.120” ERW* (No issuance of log books for cars with ERW cages 04/30/03)

*Note- Specifications listed for reference for inspection of grandfathered vehicles.

64

 

2501 - 3000 lbs.

1.500” x 0.120” Chrome-moly / Seamless mild steel (DOM)

1.750” x 0.095” Chrome-moly / Seamless mild steel (DOM)

1.750” x 0.120” ERW* (No issuance of log books for cars with ERW cages 04/30/03)

*Note- Specifications listed for reference for inspection of grandfathered vehicles.

 

3001 - 4000 lbs.

1.750” x .120” Chrome-moly / Seamless mild steel (DOM)

No ERW allowed.

 

Over 4000 lbs.

2.000” x 0.120” Chrome-moly/Seamless mild steel (DOM)

No ERW allowed.

 

I suspect that is to allow a bit more flexibility when selling a logbooked car, one owner may weigh less than another and prefer to run more or less fuel reserve than another, etc, etc - this way its legal for both owners. I also speculate that the weights vs tubing sizes are on the conservative side to make up for the jackhole that doesn't put alot of engineering or thought into his cage.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
obzezzed350

Why didnt you just go 1.75"? How much are you really saving in weight with the 1.5"?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
TurboShortBus

I stand corrected about having the driver and fuel in the car! But, if you start with a 3000 lb car (as raced, but without driver and fuel) and build a 1.5" x 0.120" cage, then load a 350 lb fatass driver into it and then fill the 20 gallon fuel cell, the full weight will be nearly 3500 lbs. That's acceptable? It is per the rules, but it seems a bit backwards to me.

 

Mark

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...