mcmmotorsports Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 You can forget it, the seller has a ZERO feedback. How do I know I can trust them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevepoe Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 (edited) You can forget it, the seller has a ZERO feedback. How do I know I can trust them What would be crazy is someone to buy it. fly out and drive it at nationals with ra1s on it and then transport it home. wonder what lap times are in that car? Think it's not tunned for miller think they would give you a couple track days if your purchased it? Edited August 12, 2009 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbodleimages Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 (edited) Thats my point. The 1999 Cobras and 2001 GT's sold by Bondurant two years ago were around $10k. $35k for a used Miller Challenge cars is only marginally less expensive than a used FR500S which would have been raced far less than the Miller car. you said it 99 cobras and 01 gt cars. . hardly any real modifications on those cars as well . those cars are outdated to say the least. and a old body style. bolt in junk cages etc etc... I don't see many used fr500s cars for sale. who is selling them, and for how much ? to me 35k seems very fair for what you are getting. doubt you could build that car for that. Steve, I have one of the 99 Cobras. The cages are not bolt in and the modifications to these cars are significant. The front suspension was modified including completely changing the front strut towers. The rear suspension was completely changed. The cooling system and fueling systems was custom made. They are the old body style, no doubt. I was offered a FR500S this past weekend for $40k. I am aware of a couple more that well may be available after the season. I am reasonable confident the deal offered this weekend could be done for around $35k. With FR500C's available race ready for between $50k and $60k and new FR500C's available for $60k from Miller(also on Ebay), $35k doesn't sound like a bargain just yet. Edited August 12, 2009 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevepoe Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 new FR500C's available for $60k from Miller(also on Ebay), new c for 60k sign me up you meant s cars correct I guess I stand corrected. I thought 35k was a pretty good deal and you can pick from 15 cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbodleimages Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 I think it could be a pretty good deal, but it depends on the actual usage of the cars in question. I got my FR500C(team built clone) for $45k with some assembly required and some spares. I saw a race ready FR500C real deal for $60k this weekend and I would guess there is some wiggle room there. The FR500S I have been offered has about 15 races on it. If the Miller Challenge cars, have 20 races on them or so, then they are not a bad bargain. If its twice that or more, then I would think not so much. I would say it would be worth a call to ask for specifics. I understand that Mustang Challenge races next season will have a class for these cars to run and when the new body style FR500S comes out the current S cars will be dropped into that class as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T&A Racing Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 Guys, I by far am not the most technical guy on this, but if this is the same car the Miller school uses as a "Challenge" car then I driven those at Miller (south course). In my opinion they are good cars, safe ect. But are not an AI car at all. They would need some money to get them even in the same zip code as most of the top AI cars. I was talking with one of the Mustang Challenge teams when they were at Autobahn and they are going to have a car in the AI field at Miller. It sounded like they were going to have to do some work to get it close and even they were not sure how close it would be to a top car. I am interested and serious about looking at getting a new car for next season so if any one knows of a good proven car up for sale let me know, I am watching the for sale forums close as well as racing junk. See you at Nationals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluefirepony Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 Andrew Cadell ripped off pretty consistent 1:36.9's at Mid-Ohio (2.258mi) in June in Mustang Challenge vs 1:34.5s by Seafuse (the top Mustang in Koni race) ...what's the AI record there? BTW, that Cadell is one consistent driver...in traffic, solo, being hunted...it was a real education just watching that race. As for the SN-95 vs S197. I've driven both - own an S197 - at this level of racing...drive what ya got. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T&A Racing Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 Don't know the record at MidO but Robin ran a 1:37.3 there last year at Nationals I also think the cars used in the actual races are bit more set up than the school cars. The cars at the school didn't even have brake cooling. But hey I could be wrong a Mustang Challeng car with 334 hp, might kick butt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Algozine Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 Tough to compare cars from MC and AI. They run very different tires, which can make a couple second difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbodleimages Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 Look at the lap times from the east coast championship races at Road Atlanta last weekend. There were two FR500S cars, a Champion Koni Challenge driver in an S197 AI car and the 2nd place Nationals AI driver in a former Grand Am Cobra. In qualifying the FR500S cars 33 Zachary Lutz 1:37.622 25 Joe Middlebrooks 1:38.489 AI cars 52 Dean Martin 1:36.637 37 Chris DeSalvo 1:38.423 The FR500S cars have stickier tires and a racing ABS module. The cars are pretty equal. Dean Martin's car has a bit more motor than a legal Mustang Challenge car and a little more suspension. My take is that the FR500S car on Toyos and with AI allowed mods is a pretty well maxxed out AI car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ST#97 Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 Andrew Cadell ripped off pretty consistent 1:36.9's at Mid-Ohio (2.258mi) in June in Mustang Challenge vs 1:34.5s by Seafuse (the top Mustang in Koni race) ...what's the AI record there? BTW, that Cadell is one consistent driver...in traffic, solo, being hunted...it was a real education just watching that race. As for the SN-95 vs S197. I've driven both - own an S197 - at this level of racing...drive what ya got. IIRC I pulled 36.9's off the trailer and 200lbs overweight in first speed session on Wednesday. Walton pulled 36.2's as did Jay Andrew? Races were different after the rains came and cleaned/greased the track. I still mumble cuss words when the rain tire topics come up! AI record is held by Mark Luna at 35.5..? Put a MC car on Toyos and I think you will see laps times drop by 1.5 to 2 full seconds. Now if you get one on the numbers with working aero...they could be the shiznit...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevepoe Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 keep in mind a miller car is on a 245 series tire as well .not a 275 Look at who and what cars are starting to run up front . the s197 car is only getting faster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbodleimages Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 The BFG 245 is about the same width as the Toyo RA1 275, isn't it? I have BFG 275's on my Cobra R for enduros and they are wider than R888's of the same size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ST#97 Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 The BFG 245 is about the same width as the Toyo RA1 275, isn't it? I have BFG 275's on my Cobra R for enduros and they are wider than R888's of the same size. yeah, those R1's are pretty wide for a 245 labeled tire... I wouldn't mind trying a set someday just for fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nape Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 IIRC I pulled 36.9's off the trailer and 200lbs overweight in first speed session on Wednesday. Walton pulled 36.2's as did Jay Andrew? Races were different after the rains came and cleaned/greased the track. I still mumble cuss words when the rain tire topics come up! AI record is held by Mark Luna at 35.5..? I was looking for it last week and I believe Jay Andrew has the record by a couple hundredths over Mark with a 1:35.9x. The record is not listed on the MW region site, so it takes a while to dig through MyLaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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