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Guys-

 

While Brian's solution does look interesting, we are not inclined to allow it at this time. We are OK with adding material to the mount to strenghten it, but chopping off the old one and welding on a new one is not OK as it opens the door to all sorts of measurements for enforcement and other slippery slopes that we'd just as soon not have to work with. I understand that there is a desire to improve the IRS, but until we come up with a way to measure changes and enforce those measurements, we want to stick with the stock cradle mounting points for both the chassis mounts and the suspension mounts.

 

Thanks.

 

-JWL

 

So as long as we keep the same OEM barrel mount on the cradle we can modify/fabricate the actual bracket that mounts the cradle to the frame rail to correct (while keeping it in the OEM position)?

 

I want to get this straight before I spend the time and money to make a mount only to have my interpretation of what you stated be questioned.

 

Can you please be a little more clear on your above ruling?

 

 

bpt

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Based on this ruling, and the rules package in general, I would say that you are absolutely correct Brian. While the crossmember is "protected" from modifications, the brackets which mount it are not, just like torque boxes which mount rear control arms can be modified.

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Brian-

 

That sounds right, but do me a solid and send me sketches of what you plan to do prior to hacking and spending. I will pass them to the Directors and make sure we're all cool with the plan before you get too deep into the fundage.

 

-JWL

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  • 2 weeks later...

Not trying to steel anyones design, but can we get a clarification on what is an acceptable mod to strengthen the bracket?

 

Can we remake a bracket as long as the subframe remains in the stock location?

Can we only add to the existing bracket?

 

Thanks

Dave

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Not trying to steel anyones design, but can we get a clarification on what is an acceptable mod to strengthen the bracket?

 

Can we remake a bracket as long as the subframe remains in the stock location?

Can we only add to the existing bracket?

 

Thanks

Dave

 

Dave I asked this question a while back also. Reading the letter of the law, the bracket is open game to anything you want to do. I want/will fab my own bracketry to get rid of the band-aid that is called the OEM bracket. The IRS carrier is protected as noted by scott but the rules say nothing about the bracket or the bushing (in fact bushings are mentioned as open in the rules as long as the carrier is in the stock location). Unless word comes down very shortly from up top that this is not the case fabbing my own bracket is the approach that I will take.

 

I never did forward any pics because that is how we got in trouble last year and I want to avoid that at all costs. This year every question is being asked in public to avoid confusion of the interested parties.

 

Also I am very interested to hear just how they tech inspectors are going to audit the pickup points of the car to an accuracy that is needed (mm's). Consider this my open question on that subject also.

 

I hope everyone is having a great day!!

 

bpt

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Guys-

 

The best approach is always to consult with me and send me some sketches of what you plan to do. I can pass them to the other directors and we're happy to get you a ruling. This may take time as we often don't agree and have to work on this stuff for a while, but we're always willing to help you plan prior to making any mods. You of course are free to do your own thing and show up at the track with it done, but that can be hazardous and puts us in the unenviable position of having to make a quick ruling at the track or suspend points until we can discuss the mod among the director's group.

 

As for enforcement, don't worry about it and we have to keep the method on the downlow so we don't give the clever and cheeky time to figure a way to defeat it. Someone is always going to figure out a way to cheat the rules a little and I want to make it as tough as possible to discourage that sort of chicanery.

 

So, if you have a question about your plans, let me know and we'll give you a ruling.

 

-JWL

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heres something else to consider....

 

In b_tone's pic, cutting off that rear mount would eliminate 2 of the bushings, so would it be a good or bad idea to do something about the front?

 

Part of me thinks aluminum bushings in the front would stiffen the subframe to the chassis of the car, but i'm also thinking leaving the stock rubber (or replacing with poly) for the front bushings would allow for some chassis flex that the car would normally see.....which would avoid stress cracks in the long run. Leaving a softer bushing might be a better choice for non-caged cars, whereas more of a solid mount would be better for a caged car.

 

Also, how much harsher of a ride would eliminating the subrame bushings be for those of us who might want to do this on a daily driver (with a few HPDE events during the year)? These rear bushings on the subframe have been giving me problems with the rear moving side to side under hard acceleration in my 01 Cobra, so i'm definately thinking about doing this myself.

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Folks-

 

The directors have discussed the bracket issue and we've decided that you have to leave them in place and mount the IRS using the original bracket. Bushing material is free, but no offset bushings are allowed and you also may brace the stock bracket to strengthen it. The Steeda approach is one acceptable example, but I'm sure many of you can figure out something a little bit more elegant. I will add a tech bulletin shortly so that everyone is on notice that the brackets must remain.

 

-JWL

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Folks-

 

The directors have discussed the bracket issue and we've decided that you have to leave them in place and mount the IRS using the original bracket. Bushing material is free, but no offset bushings are allowed and you also may brace the stock bracket to strengthen it. The Steeda approach is one acceptable example, but I'm sure many of you can figure out something a little bit more elegant. I will add a tech bulletin shortly so that everyone is on notice that the brackets must remain.

 

-JWL

 

What directors??

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What directors??

 

John Lindsey, Ryan Flaherty, Peder Beckman, Todd Covini, Bryan Shugg, Chris Griswold

 

FYI

 

So Eric Meehan the OH/IN Regional Director had no input!!??

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What directors??

 

John Lindsey, Ryan Flaherty, Peder Beckman, Todd Covini, Bryan Shugg, Chris Griswold

 

FYI

 

Where are you guys getting your technical information?

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Where are you guys getting your technical information?

 

 

Most of the questions are based off interpetation of the rules. So not a lot of "Tech" is needed, more discussion of intent and interpretation. The Technical information comes from actual measurements of sample cars in question, other dependable racers with the same cars have been called on, and some Aftermarket suppliers information and specifications have also supplied requested information. If more is needed the information is well researched by any means necessary.

 

Personally, I have been impressed with the process of the decisions being made. There is a great discussion of all aspects on questions that have come up. There are those who like to think the rules making process is arbitrary, but being involved I can tell you there is nothing farther from the truth. There are always "negative" people in every group who try to discredit the process but you just have to keep it tongue in cheek and move on and do the best you can for all the members, and the growth of the organization.

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Where are you guys getting your technical information?

 

 

Most of the questions are based off interpetation of the rules. So not a lot of "Tech" is needed, more discussion of intent and interpretation. The Technical information comes from actual measurements of sample cars in question, other dependable racers with the same cars have been called on, and some Aftermarket suppliers information and specifications have also supplied requested information. If more is needed the information is well researched by any means necessary.

 

Personally, I have been impressed with the process of the decisions being made. There is a great discussion of all aspects on questions that have come up. There are those who like to think the rules making process is arbitrary, but being involved I can tell you there is nothing farther from the truth. There are always "negative" people in every group who try to discredit the process but you just have to keep it tongue in cheek and move on and do the best you can for all the members, and the growth of the organization.

 

Chris,

 

Since I appear to labeled as one of the "negative" people I would like to keep everyone honest and say that in my personal experience I know for a FACT that you are correct in saying that SOME of the aftermarket companies are consulted and provided information and would like to also add that some have not.

 

Hopefully with you involved it will get better. I really do mean that.

 

This whole IRS discussion has me speechless (amazing I know). I could go one and one but I know what the end result is........

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Mark,

 

That statement was not an attack on you, or anyone for that matter. I was not refering to anything specific about the IRS, more rules and the rule making process in general. The "negativity" was not directed at you or anyone. I was not being specific for that reason. I was trying to point out that from what I have seen being involved more, the organization does everything in its power to keep the playing field level, the costs down, and making sure everyone has fun, safe events.

 

See you at the track!

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  • 2 years later...

I see this is a pretty old thread... needed to do a little research to make sure that the Taz brackets were legal.

 

I'm getting ready to install the Billetflow brackets, since I was getting a bracing panel for the cover from them... just thought I'd mention that I'm really impressed with the quality of everything I've bought from them so far.

 

Probably doesn't matter that mutch, but the brackets are much heavier... I mean beefier... and they bend them slightly to follow the contours. Grade 8 bolts also, and there's three of them

 

I'll probably end up tying in the rear cage load distribution plates... for whenever I get around to that.

 

Dave

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John,

 

I'm not sure if you are correct in your comments on this one. According to the rules (6.1C) the IRS carrier MUST be umodified. Welding these brackets to the IRS carrier is a modification to the carrier and is therefore illegal.

 

Is that a correct interpretation of the rules as they are written?

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John,

 

I'm not sure if you are correct in your comments on this one. According to the rules (6.1C) the IRS carrier MUST be umodified. Welding these brackets to the IRS carrier is a modification to the carrier and is therefore illegal.

 

Is that a correct interpretation of the rules as they are written?

If that was correct, then the IRS cradle in the Blue car would be illegal because it has a cooling pump bracket welded to it??
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When we originally went through this we were told that ANY modification to the IRS cradle was illegal. That position has changed.......

 

It is a moot point anyway I guess.

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