Grizlbits Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Steve, your dash looks like boobies on a bull. The tan color does not match. Maybe if you painted the entire dash a flat black or something that may help. Everything in the picture says "RACE CAR", except the dash. Maybe if the dash had some real wood grain accents like some of the Cadillacs. I can't wait until I see the first Cadillac in AI with a wood grain dash. Wood grain in a race car, I just can't wait. Do you really keep the seat that close, or was Greg driving last and he couldn't reach the pedals? I am done stirring the pot now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UBR Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 So every car with a dash is a show car then? . Our car has a "dash". It is a black anodized aluminum boxed panel that sits in front of the driver and has a purpose. There's a tach, oil pressure, oil and water temp, fuel guage and volt meter. Just to the right of the gauges is our switch panel. The whole thing stops about mid car, at the end of the drivers reach. http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/5GNOOt3EpcEy4CB4M2LsaA?feat=embedwebsite Functional, not pretty. Why is there a need for it to extend all the way across to the passenger A pillar? Advertising? We have a sticker for our engine shop on the side of our half dash. First thing you see when you look in the right side window. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QUASAR Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Dash.. thats a tough one. I'm in favor of it, but I think the time to make that decision was a long time ago. Its understandable that its hard to justify when it serves no functional purpose in a race car whatsoever. However, peeking into a race car and seeing the inside of the firewall and a dash bar with steering wheel mounted to it is rather.. boring? Might as well be a tube frame chassis car whats the difference. The dash gives some ties to its street car roots and says distinctively "Mustang!", "Camaro!", "Firebird!" etc. I was prepared to pull mine this winter but I guess it can stay in now. Still have to pull it to get the heater core and blower motor out, or maybe I should leave it in for the colder spring races. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T&A Racing Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 (edited) I like the point about attracting sponsor to the series, not even sure I disagree, but I don't think the rule will produce those results. Which is why I am asking about the goal so that I can get as close to the goal as possible not just the letter of the rule. I don't mind spending a few bucks on things just to make the series better over time if that is clearly stated and explained. If the goal is to have a production appearance to the inside then let's make that the rule, the goal is neat, clean and no exposed wires then lets say that. Picking on the dash may not lead to postive results in any way, based on the rule as written I could slap tin on it run my wires on top of it, a tie wrap them to holes in the tin. Not exactly the results of the first picture. Sorry Todd, don't intend to keep this spinning even though you said you would take a few days to get us the reasoning behind the new rules. Thanks Mark Edited December 10, 2009 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92MNstanger Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 edited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firehawkclone Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 One could run duct tape from a small guage pod to the otherside and meet the rule! Im sure thats not what they had in mind. And there is no rule in AI that will ever bring any sponsor in, its a dream if you think it will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jay A. Posted December 11, 2009 Members Share Posted December 11, 2009 I think the dash thing is a decoy. It gave the group some little, trivial thing to whine about instead of some more substantial sections of the new rules, which were well thought out and re-written. Jay Andrew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T&A Racing Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 I think the dash thing is a decoy. It gave the group some little, trivial thing to whine about instead of some more substantial sections of the new rules, which were well thought out and re-written. Jay Andrew Good theory Jay, you may be absolutly correct. Time will tell, I didn't see anything big at least as far as my car goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Tornado Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Actually it all looked pretty good to me. There was even some cool updates that I think will help. Man where was that 3 run avg dyno runs and water temp rules for the 2007 Nationals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssfab Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Well the ls rule just put four car out in the west coast. I guess thats how you make a class grow when car count is only 6- 10 cars now you have 2-6 cars. Good job guys!!! Pat,Andy,Massey,Jim all have to find somewere to race now. I don't see any of them switching back to a ford when they can just race in another class. These are all high quality racecars that you guys just kicked out over ford purrist bull shit!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DHarsay Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Well the ls rule just put four car out in the west coast... Pat,Andy,Massey,Jim all have to find somewere to race now. Isn't that a 2012 rule? Is that out of protest? Or are you exaggerating? Where would those cars be legal and competitive "now" (besides AI for the next two seasons)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbodleimages Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 is your avatar the prop on a king air? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssfab Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Well the ls rule just put four car out in the west coast... Pat,Andy,Massey,Jim all have to find somewere to race now. Isn't that a 2012 rule? Is that out of protest? Or are you exaggerating? Where would those cars be legal and competitive "now" (besides AI for the next two seasons)? Yes but the rule is still stupid we can run redline time attack . It's more fun to race door to door but its clear you don't want us to advancw the class Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKnight Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Yes but the rule is still stupid we can run redline time attack . It's more fun to race door to door but its clear you don't want us to advancw the class I never saw the problem with engine transplants personally, so not a big fan of this rule. That said, all these folks do have 2 years in which to migrate back to Ford engines. Sure, it's not a trivial thing to do, and you guys invested considerable resources to get to where you are now, but reverting back to the original configuration shouldn't be terribly difficult. But yes, it still sucks. I suppose in comparison, my irritation that I have to put a stock dash back in the car shouldn't be so great. Jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_tone Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 I suppose in comparison, my irritation that I have to put a stock dash back in the car shouldn't be so great. Jason It doesn't have to be a stock dash, you can make a nice lightweight aluminum dash for next to nothing in under a day. I don't understand why people think that putting a fabricated dash in a car is all that difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbodleimages Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 i dont think people like being told what to spend their money on. i doubt there are many with dashes that were thinking of removing them that dislike this change. its just those that have removed them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKnight Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 It doesn't have to be a stock dash, you can make a nice lightweight aluminum dash for next to nothing in under a day. I don't understand why people think that putting a fabricated dash in a car is all that difficult. Ah, looks like my reading comprehension was less than stellar. We have a facsimile of a dash in the stock location, but it doesn't stretch from A pillar to A pillar. Still, better than changing the engine. i dont think people like being told what to spend their money on. i doubt there are many with dashes that were thinking of removing them that dislike this change. its just those that have removed them. Obviously. Folks that have to spend money to make their car compliant are going to be bent to some degree. I'm a tad bit bent about the dash, Lindsey, Massey, et al are bent that they have to decide whether to go back to a Ford powerplant or find somewhere else to play. I assume that the folks in charge spent a non-trivial amount of time weighing their decisions and think that this is for the overall good of the series. What I'm waiting for is the promised insight into the why of these changes. When you get a chance Todd, would be nice to hear the reasoning. Jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AIX9 Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 I am no fan of a chevy in a Ford, but I am even less of a fan about losing good people that followed the rules. This is not a trivial change for these guys. I know how these guys feel as I removed my wiper box (not cowl) and people complained so much I now primarily run SU, you can bolt on a turbo but removing the wiper box is apparantly too great of a performance advantage. Anyway back on track. I say grandfather these guys in, there interpretation of the rules shouldnt force them into another class or series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firehawkclone Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 Im sure the Ford guys will get the aftermarket Alum block. Just one more thing to make them faster, just like everything else they are given. Notting that is said will change how stupid the dash rule is! I will show up with a duct tape dash just becuase! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T&A Racing Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 I suppose in comparison, my irritation that I have to put a stock dash back in the car shouldn't be so great. Jason It doesn't have to be a stock dash, you can make a nice lightweight aluminum dash for next to nothing in under a day. I don't understand why people think that putting a fabricated dash in a car is all that difficult. I don't think you read closely the other post, it is not about how difficult, or expensive the dash is, it is more about it being pointless with no reason. Todd says he is going to explain, if it's a good one great, if it's not then I guess we can express our opinions. I also agree the engine thing is a much bigger pain and costs, again for no real clear reason, at least yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IGZOSTD Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 Troy, the Chevy powered Ford's will still be legal in AIX. I don't think the current bastard cars should be forced out in 2012 eather. But what do I know, I haven't even finished my build. and as for the Ford Motorsports aluminum block, I don't see where this is listed as a legal block for AI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firehawkclone Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 and as for the Ford Motorsports aluminum block, I don't see where this is listed as a legal block for AI. Its not! But with the ls1 being pulled from the Ford guys, they will give the Ford guys the block. Just like everything else they get......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Hartman Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 I personally like the dash rule. I think it adds the to overall appearance of the cars and the series which in turns gives people a positive attitude towards it. Thats why I decided to leave it in even before this rule was brought up. Just my .02. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigKeyserSoze Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 I can only imagine the personal satisfaction felt by the NASA people in charge of the rules after spending a boatload of time, unpaid, working on rules that they thought were fair, only to have a lot of people complain about them. This follows the "you can't make everyone happy all the time" rule. Rest assured that the powers that be considered the upside and downside of every rule change. Truth be told, no matter what rules they put in place, no one would be completely happy. I am a trial lawyer by trade. I think a lot of the rules of procedure really suck. The rules of evidence suck even worse. But, they are the rules, therefore I read them, understand them, and play by them. I haven't the time or the inclination to get appointed onto the not-for-profit board that makes the rule suggestions and revisions, therefore (other than right now), I don't even complain about them. My wife is a condominium and homeowner association attorney. People on the boards of directors of those entities are much like the NASA officials here. They do a thankless job, without pay, and burn up dozens of hours of their own personal time every month and then take a hellacious beating for every decision they make, even though there never is a "right" decision that could be made, because then someone else would complain. The point of my rant is to encourage all of you to give these poor people a break. There was a lot of comment on the rules before they were approved. A lot. The decisions have been made. Let it go now, get your wrenches, do what you have to do to be legal by the indicated timelines (which were generous), and let's race and have fun. The NASA people are doing what they in their hearts truly think is right for the series. I have yet to meet a NASA official that isn't a true gear head down to the core. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizlbits Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 I take back *some* of the things that I have said about lawyers in the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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