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n80

Same old brake questions... different noob.

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n80

I've just signed up for my first ever HPDE. It will be the Oct. 22/23 event at Carolina Motorsports Park. I've never done any sort of track event.

 

My car is a 2006 Infiniti G35 coupe, 6MT, OEM sport suspension, 19" forged rims, no mods, new Hankook Ventus V12 evo K100 (what a silly name for a low end tire!). New it claimed 298 fwHP. It now has 90k on it. It has been well maintained although the clutch had to be rpelaced at 60k by the former owner.

 

Currently everything seems to be functioning perfectly except the brakes. Recently on a road trip on some very tight mountain roads I'd get some shudder from the right front with very hard braking. I'm guessing OEM pads have less than half left on them. Rotors look and feel fine.

 

So my plan is to have the rotors turned on a ProCut (on car system) to make sure they are true, replace the pads and bleed/purge brake fluid and replace with Motul or something like that.

 

Does that sound reasonable enough for a first ever event? And if so, which pads? This model does not have the Brembo brakes and the car is a bit of a pig at 3500#. I would like to install a pad I can use at the track and on the street. I'm leaning toward EBC Yellowstuff. A friend has a late 60's Mustang which he primarily uses on the track and he uses Yellowstuff and is pleased with them. I've heard others who didn't like them. Any advice much appreciated.

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obzezzed350

The yellowstuff are not bad for an entry level pad, I think you will be fine with them. The shudder sounds like a warped rotor to me. Turning them should fix it.

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MR_E

I run Yellowstuff on my MR2 and really like them. I agree that it sounds like you've got a warped rotor.

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kbrew8991

Since brake systems vary so much between platforms I'd seek the advice of people that track a car as similar to yours as you can find (weight, power level, tires, brake package, and note their experience level as well). Brake Company A's Pad #111 might be great for a low hp light car on street tires, but be horrible once you add some weight and horsepower to it. Brake Company B's Pad #222 might be great for higher hp, heavier weight, and sticky tires but might be waaayyyy too much pad for the lighter car & lower hp. Etc, Etc, Etc.

 

I'm a fan of just replacing rotors vs turning, but that might be a function of the ~$20 a piece rotors that these little non-turbo MR2s use

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n80

Thanks guys. I've tried the G35 forums, but that's pretty much of a tune and show sort of forum, not much info on actual track use. The 'Z' forums might be a good place since the G35 is pretty much a longer heavier 350Z.

 

I've thought about replacing the rotors, but even the OEMs aren't cheap. The aftermarket 'sport' type rotors are downright pricey. EBC actually recommends the ProCut system if you don't replace the rotors and it is cheaper than having the rotors pulled and cut. It might just be hype. But I'm counting pennies here right now.

 

I have done brake work myself in the past, but I recently moved and no longer have a garage. Pretty much just a driveway....which isn't nearly level. So my mechanic DIY projects are pretty limited.

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kbrew8991

That might work - just check which setup they have on the car - I imagine you can run alot less agressive pad with the nice Brembo track package setup than if you had the smaller stuff. And so on.

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Cooper93
Thanks guys. I've tried the G35 forums, but that's pretty much of a tune and show sort of forum, not much info on actual track use. The 'Z' forums might be a good place since the G35 is pretty much a longer heavier 350Z.

 

I've thought about replacing the rotors, but even the OEMs aren't cheap. The aftermarket 'sport' type rotors are downright pricey. EBC actually recommends the ProCut system if you don't replace the rotors and it is cheaper than having the rotors pulled and cut. It might just be hype. But I'm counting pennies here right now.

 

I have done brake work myself in the past, but I recently moved and no longer have a garage. Pretty much just a driveway....which isn't nearly level. So my mechanic DIY projects are pretty limited.

 

Give Motion Lab a call. They are on South Blvd, Clt. If you are in the market for replacement parts, they have the lowest prices around and will beat anyone's price. Tell them I sent you. 7zero4.5two7.0100 or

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MikeAtl

I have been tracking a stock 04 G35 sedan, 6mt, for a few HPDE weekends at Road Atlanta, TGPR (hard on brakes/tires) and recently Roebling Road. Here's what I have done. YMMV. I am still quite a noob, and my speeds are slower than many. More experienced folks please chime in.

 

Replaced front rotors with Centric Premium stock replacements. No slotting or drilling. cheap ($45 each) and much better price and quality than stock. My first weekend at RA resulted in quite a bit of front end shake under hard braking, which I eventually diagnosed to a warped factory rotor. Fixed with the new rotors.

 

I run Hawk HP+ pads on the track. These are also OK on the street and will get you to and from OK if you don't mind some squeaking, but I only use them for track weekends, and a few days before and after. I have been pretty happy with these, and they have survived 5 track weekends so far, but are now ready to be replaced. I use Hawk ceramics between track weekends.

 

Complete change to ATE 200 (amber or blue brake fluid), which I bleed before and after each track weekend.

 

I just bought a set of the Hankook Ventus V12 evo's and have run them at RA and Roebling. As I said, I am still a noob, but I am not at all happy with these tires. Maybe it's a function of the relatively narrow size and 50 series aspect ratio I run, but they seem to howl a good bit and my fronts roll over quite a bit when cornering. Raising front pressure a bit helps, but do not go too high. Paddock consensus received from a few people over the two weekends is that the Hankook evos do not handle heat particularly well and get greasy fast.

 

I am at the point now that the stock suspension feels very soft and the car wallows a good bit also, so that may be a contributing factor, along with a healthy dose of driver inexperience.

 

Drink lots of water, have an open mind for receiving instruction, and have fun.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Mike

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n80

Thanks Cooper, I'll look them up.

 

Thanks Mike. I got the Hankooks for the same reason most people do: they're cheap! Plus these G35's sure do eat front tires so cheap is good.

 

Mine are 19's with a 45 aspect ratio so maybe they won't roll over as bad. I was suprised to hear you say your suspension feels soft. With these 19's my suspensions feels almost unpleasantly harsh. Every expansion joint rattles my teeth. Body roll seems minimal in mine too....but I've never tracked it so my perception may change after a few laps. Does yours have the factory sport suspension? It has significantly heavier springs and larger anti-sways. I considered some Hotchkis adjsutable sways but I'm not going to make any mods until I've had it on the track and actually have some idea about what I'm talking about.

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MikeAtl

Yup, sport package, but 17" wheels.

 

Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

 

Mike

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Cerulaen

I have the same car as you: 2006 G35 Coupe, Sport Suspension, 19s, etc. I also have Hankook Ventus 12s on the car as well.

 

I ran this car from 2006 until late 2009 when I bought my Lotus. I still occasionally bring it to the track when it's only a one day event, or when the Lotus is out of commission.

 

So for your first few events I would do the following(if some of this has been mentioned I apologize...trying to write this quick before a meeting):

 

Bleed out the brakes and get good Dot 4 fluid in there. Motul is fine and not that expensive compared to say Castrol SRF.

Use a good sport pad for your first few track days.

If it's in the cards financially, replace the rotors. Don't cut them. Cutting them removes material and lowers the amount of heat they can handle.

Replacing them in the driveway is not a big deal. I used to go to the track, replace all four rotors and pads in about 40 minutes. It's not hard once you get used to it.

 

Those tires should be fine as well...I just ran them about 3 weeks ago and they are fine for a street tire.

 

Also, you may think the ride feels firm now...but wait until you get on a bumpy track...you will wish it was a lot firmer!!

 

Good luck, let me know if you need any other info on the car. Both myself and the head instructor for the Northeast used to run them, so we have a lot of knowledge between us on it.

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n80

Thanks Joe. Great tips.

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Renesisfury
I've just signed up for my first ever HPDE. It will be the Oct. 22/23 event at Carolina Motorsports Park. I've never done any sort of track event.

 

My car is a 2006 Infiniti G35 coupe, 6MT, OEM sport suspension, 19" forged rims, no mods, new Hankook Ventus V12 evo K100 (what a silly name for a low end tire!). New it claimed 298 fwHP. It now has 90k on it. It has been well maintained although the clutch had to be rpelaced at 60k by the former owner.

You do realize that your car is rear wheel drive right?

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n80

You do realize that your car is rear wheel drive right?

 

Yes. But I couldn't figure out why you were asking until I saw that I had said, "298 fwHP". I meant 'fly wheel' horsepower, not 'front wheel'. I guess I used the wrong abbreviation.

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Renesisfury

You do realize that your car is rear wheel drive right?

 

Yes. But I couldn't figure out why you were asking until I saw that I had said, "298 fwHP". I meant 'fly wheel' horsepower, not 'front wheel'. I guess I used the wrong abbreviation.

Ahhhh, just wanted to make sure you knew.

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n80

Ahhhh, just wanted to make sure you knew.

 

300 horsepower and no torque steer gave it away.

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n80

Okay, I've decided on pads. But now I can't decide what to do about rotors. My current rotors look and feel fine but as mentioned there is some shudder from the front right under heavy breaking so I've got to do something. The cheapest aftermarket 'sport' rotors are around $250 a pair. I'll save on labor by doing it myself if I buy rotors. But, I can get the current ones turned and trued for a good bit less than buying new.

 

Again, I'm pinching pennies here. So would it be reasonable just to put some cheap basic (non-sport, non-drilled or slotted) aftermarket rotors on there?

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Cooper93

 

Again, I'm pinching pennies here. So would it be reasonable just to put some cheap basic (non-sport, non-drilled or slotted) aftermarket rotors on there?

 

NEVER pinch pennies when it comes to safety (especially brakes). I would get some autozone specials if you can't squeeze some higher quality rotors into your budget. Normally, blanks are sufficient for DE's. I had autozone specials on my 400hp Subaru when I first started. Now I have moved up to Power Slot slotted.

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beerkat
... as mentioned there is some shudder from the front right under heavy breaking so I've got to do something.

 

Before you buy some new rotors take some brake clean and 3M scouring pads and clean the rotors. then bed your new pads in. I have gotten brake shudder from poor pad transfer. I have cracked quite a few rotors but have never had a warped one.

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Cerulaen
... as mentioned there is some shudder from the front right under heavy breaking so I've got to do something.

 

Before you buy some new rotors take some brake clean and 3M scouring pads and clean the rotors. then bed your new pads in. I have gotten brake shudder from poor pad transfer. I have cracked quite a few rotors but have never had a warped one.

 

beerkat brings up a great point that I meant to make as well.

 

I would actually put my track rotors that felt "warped" back on the car and put street pads on. After a day of driving, the street pads would wear off all the accumulated deposits and the rotors would feel true again.

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n80

Thanks guys. I'm nervous about getting this HPDE all set up and paid for and then getting there and have my weekend ruined by bad brakes.

 

So, I think I'm going to have a mechanic inspect the fronts for run out, etc. If there is plenty enough rotor for a cut, I'll have him use an on-car lathe to cut them and install the EBC Yellowstuff pads. If the disks are too worn or damaged to cut them, then I'll get new rotors and do the whole thing myself.

 

I'll do the rears at home myself.

 

Doing it that way I can get it all done for about $300 including the pads. If I have to buy new rotors, I might as well get decent ones and that's going to get closer to $450.

 

I'll do the bleed and new fluid myself.

 

This would be a lot easier if I wasn't such a tightwad and I'd just get a Brembo system all around.

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Cerulaen
Thanks guys. I'm nervous about getting this HPDE all set up and paid for and then getting there and have my weekend ruined by bad brakes.

 

So, I think I'm going to have a mechanic inspect the fronts for run out, etc. If there is plenty enough rotor for a cut, I'll have him use an on-car lathe to cut them and install the EBC Yellowstuff pads. If the disks are too worn or damaged to cut them, then I'll get new rotors and do the whole thing myself.

 

I'll do the rears at home myself.

 

Doing it that way I can get it all done for about $300 including the pads. If I have to buy new rotors, I might as well get decent ones and that's going to get closer to $450.

 

I'll do the bleed and new fluid myself.

 

This would be a lot easier if I wasn't such a tightwad and I'd just get a Brembo system all around.

 

I'm sure some would disagree with me, but I think you are better off driving the car stock. Work up to the limits of the car. Once you can routinely get to the limits of the car, identifying what those limits are and making improvements that expand those limits becomes easier. Save the money on that Brembo kit and just buy more track days.

 

As for the rotors...I've bought the "good" rotors, and I've bought the "cheap" rotors. In my opinion the differences between them were not worth the extra money, go with the cheap. I know some will disagree, and for some cars this opinion is probably not true, but for this car I believe it is.

 

Joe

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n80

Thanks Joe. I was kidding about the Brembo kit. I'm way too tight for that (I can spray paint my stock rotors red for about $1.50 ). But, just eyeballing the current pads it looks like they are pretty close to due for replacement anyway so getting new pads is in the cards anyhow. And getting the front rotors turned on the car is less than even the oem type rotors.

 

So for $300 bucks and a little of my own labor I'll get trued front rotors and decent track day pads on all four corners.

 

And this car is a load too at 3500+ pounds. I'd hate to show up with old pads and have my brakes turn to mush.

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Cerulaen

Sorry, I probably wasn't clear. I definitely agree with the new pads. I was just saying not to pay extra for more expensive rotors.

 

Also, with me in it and about half a tank of gas the car weighed 3750 on the scales.

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beerkat

IMHO and that of many others, The best money you can spend now is seat time and more seat time. I would run the car stock, like it is, until you get to HPDE3. I do not consider brake pad upgrades as a mod, better pads are safety parts. Oh case you not already discovered this, Driving events are addictive and expensive. It doses not get any cheaper as you go so you need to give up being tight wad and just have fun.

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