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n80

Bedding brakes at the track.

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n80

I just ordered a set of Carbotech brake pads. Carbotech recommends bedding the pads on the track using the following procedure (which seems very general):

 

Once on track perform several moderate (medium) near stops (to a very slow rolling speed) to thoroughly warm up the pads and rotors. This should take 1-2 laps. This allows a thin layer of the pad material to be transferred into the micro-grooves of the rotor.

 

After the pads/rotors are warm, perform a series of hard near stops (to a slow rolling speed) until some brake fade is felt. This process should take about 2-4 laps (depending on the track). Once this occurs, then stay off the brakes (as much as possible) and bring your car into the pits/paddock to completely cool. Do not lock the tires during this operation.

 

Allow brake pads and/or rotors cool down to ambient temperatures; no less than 30 minutes. The total bedding procedure should not take more than 5-6 laps or about 10-15 minutes

 

The problem is that I don't see how this can be accomplished during an HPDE event, especially if there are a lot of cars on the track. Plus, I do not want to spend an entire track session ($$) bedding brakes. It seems to me that this could be done on a low traffic back road but Carbotech says only to do this on the track.

 

Is that just a C.Y.A safety/ liability statement? Is there any reason other than that for not doing this on the road? Any help appreciated.

Edited by Guest

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kbrew8991

bit of a CYA on their part to say track only. Take of that what you will...

 

be careful

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n80

I got XP10s for the front and XP8s for the rear, both of which will probably be perfectly safe for limited street use. Plus I have plenty of quiet, open back roads to do this on so I think I will do it that way. I really don't want to be on the track with 30 other HPDE-2 cars while I'm doing "moderate" stops and coming to a "very slow rolling speed".

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beerkat

There is some who think that if you drive around town with your track pads and rotors that you will end up with a better life span for your brakes. I have that mine set so when I get my car back this weekend I will be doing just that.

 

You may know this but if you run different pads on the street than the track you should have two sets of rotors also. the reason is that you will be running two different pad compounds so you will need to clean or wear off one compound before the other one will work at it's full potential.

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JohnPutnam

I have driven around the paddock dragging my brakes in order to bed them before.

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jimbow
I got XP10s for the front and XP8s for the rear, both of which will probably be perfectly safe for limited street use. Plus I have plenty of quiet, open back roads to do this on so I think I will do it that way. I really don't want to be on the track with 30 other HPDE-2 cars while I'm doing "moderate" stops and coming to a "very slow rolling speed".

 

I always find a vacant parking lot and bed them in there before an event. There are lots of empty parking lots around me where I can get a good head of steam before slamming on the binders

Lonely country road works as well.

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ReaperX
Lonely country road works as well.

 

This is one that I use since I live a little ways in the "country". First time I bedded in a set of track pads I hung out in the garage for 20 minutes with a fire extinguisher just incase some fluid some how dripped on the rotors and caught fire. My garage was quite smokey that evening.

 

With your situation the rotor swap might work best.... I know of a few people who do that.

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Cooper93
I got XP10s for the front and XP8s for the rear, both of which will probably be perfectly safe for limited street use.

 

HAH. No. Unless you're running something like a Star Spec. The XP10's will definitely over ride your ABS and lock up all season tires. Ask me how I know.

 

Also, I did my bedding in on the street (with the Star Specs). I seriously doubt you'll be able to bed them in properly with all season tires. Good luck, though!

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n80

Well, I told Mike at Carbotech what I was driving and he made the XP10/XP8 recommendation. But all I said was 'street tires'. Maybe he assumed that if I was on the track I wouldn't be on all season tires. This Z does weigh close to 3500 pounds.

 

Unfortunately the car does have W rated all seasons on it now. My intentions are to get a set of Star Specs or Hankook Ventus R-S3 (140 tread wear) but I may not have them before the next track day.

 

I have not had any problem with locking the brakes or ABS with EBC Yellowstuff pads and these tires.

 

I'd love to have some Star Specs now.....but I just don't have the funds. So I'm going to have a hard time not locking up the brakes at CMP in June?

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kbrew8991
I got XP10s for the front and XP8s for the rear, both of which will probably be perfectly safe for limited street use.

 

HAH. No. Unless you're running something like a Star Spec. The XP10's will definitely over ride your ABS and lock up all season tires. Ask me how I know.

 

Also, I did my bedding in on the street (with the Star Specs). I seriously doubt you'll be able to bed them in properly with all season tires. Good luck, though!

 

pad compound recommendations are very platform specific since weights, powers, brake sizing, etc varies wildly between cars...

 

What is "too much" for a WRX might be just right for something else

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whoahstu

If it's CarboTech recommended, you have an excellent pad combo. Even when using the "track" break in proceedure, I still couldn't lock up the wheels. It took all the heat it could.

 

You'll be fine.

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t500hps

I think you'll be OK with the pads, not sure what the tires are going to do though.....I started HPDE last year so I'm not far ahead of you (I think). I'm in a Charger SRT8 that weighs 4,250 before I get my 215 lbs in it. I'm running XP 12/10 (front/rear) on a 275 summer tire. I was told by several that run Chargers to use this brake combo but have had others say it's too aggressive. ABS does activate but so far it's working well.......except the power steering pump has failed twice. I did make functional brake ducts and use a separate set of front rotors and they still warp after 2-3 track weekends (I'm getting pretty fast and driving pretty hard).

 

 

BTW: I swap the pads on Thursday night before track weekends and drive the car to work on friday......bedding the pads and holding my ears as they squeal like a pig. I tow the car to the track on a trailer mainly so I can get it home if something goes wrong.

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whoahstu
I think you'll be OK with the pads, not sure what the tires are going to do though.....I started HPDE last year so I'm not far ahead of you (I think). I'm in a Charger SRT8 that weighs 4,250 before I get my 215 lbs in it. I'm running XP 12/10 (front/rear) on a 275 summer tire. I was told by several that run Chargers to use this brake combo but have had others say it's too aggressive. ABS does activate but so far it's working well.......except the power steering pump has failed twice. I did make functional brake ducts and use a separate set of front rotors and they still warp after 2-3 track weekends (I'm getting pretty fast and driving pretty hard).

 

 

BTW: I swap the pads on Thursday night before track weekends and drive the car to work on friday......bedding the pads and holding my ears as they squeal like a pig. I tow the car to the track on a trailer mainly so I can get it home if something goes wrong.

Jesus...just get a Miata. You'll be faster and save money, lol!

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jimbow
I got XP10s for the front and XP8s for the rear, both of which will probably be perfectly safe for limited street use. Plus I have plenty of quiet, open back roads to do this on so I think I will do it that way. I really don't want to be on the track with 30 other HPDE-2 cars while I'm doing "moderate" stops and coming to a "very slow rolling speed".

 

I ran the same combo on my heavy corvette - a little over 3500lbs with treadwear 340 tires when it was a combo vehicle. Only warning is watch for lockup going into the U turn at CMP.

Your trying to go from north of 100 to what 40ish to wrestle around the turn.

 

Just bed them on that country road or a parking lot, you'll be fine

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n80

Thanks. I might just bite the bullet and get a set of Star Specs or something similar on some new rims just for the track anyway. Its just money.

 

It really is probably time for me to do that. A weekend at the track starts at around $300 just for registration. Throw in food, hotel, etc and it goes up fast. I don't want to ruin the whole weekend because I'm constantly locking the brakes at turn 1 or 8. At least thats the way I'm going to explain it to my wife.

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n80
Jesus...just get a Miata.

 

WWJD (What would Jesus drive)?

 

Probably not a Miata.

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ME2z
Thanks. I might just bite the bullet and get a set of Star Specs or something similar on some new rims just for the track anyway. Its just money.

 

It really is probably time for me to do that. A weekend at the track starts at around $300 just for registration. Throw in food, hotel, etc and it goes up fast. I don't want to ruin the whole weekend because I'm constantly locking the brakes at turn 1 or 8. At least thats the way I'm going to explain it to my wife.

 

I have Start Specs on my Z and absolutely love them. I found some 18" stock rims on Ebay for $400. I should have not gone with the staggered wheels however. Before that I was running Goodyear Eagle F1 All Season tires. They would get hot by the end of the day and start to get greasy. They would talk really loud before they started to loose traction. And they would loose traction often. The first time the car went sideways at NCCAR was a great learning experience. So I would say that locking the brakes at turn 1 or 8 is a good thing. Gaining experience on bad tires is going to make you a much better driver in the long run. If you have only driven 2 sessions or so I would recommend taking the money for the Star Specs and spend them on more track time.

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n80

I've had four track events so far. All at CMP. My current tires are some no-name brand that came on the car, very hard and as you say, they get hot and slick and are not much fun. No spins yet but sideways more than once. They squeal all the way through the carousel, pretty much all the way through 11-13 and in 14. In the rain last week at CMP they were so slippery that I didn't finish the last session.

 

Anyway, I might split the difference. TireRack has Hankook Ventus evo's on sale cheap. They are not as sticky as Star Specs but I have run a set at CMP on my previous car (G35 coupe) and they are light years better than the tires on my Z (El Dorado Velozza all season 360 tread wear). I'm going to get some 18x9 rims and put either 265/40/18s or 275/40/18s on all four corners. I can get these mounted, balanced and shipped for $1500 total. Stepping up to Star Specs or a 140 rated Hankook would put me over $2000 and I'm trying to pinch pennies. (As if).

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ejabour

IMHO it is well worth the nominal fee to have the carbotechs per bedded.

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Mark@OGRacing.com

It's hard to get a good bedding doing it on the street. I would do the bedding on the track following Carbotech's bedding procedure. Go out at the tail end of your group. By the second session you'll be good to go. You need to get the transfer layer of the old pads off and lay down a new layer of your current pads.

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n80

Thanks Mark. I will be using brand new rotors. Not sure if that changes things or not. Maybe I could get the initial steps of the bed in done on the street and then get the hard braking done at the track.

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jimbow
Thanks Mark. I will be using brand new rotors. Not sure if that changes things or not. Maybe I could get the initial steps of the bed in done on the street and then get the hard braking done at the track.

 

With new rotors and new pads you need to bed them (or at least most of the procedure) before you get to the track.

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autobodyX
Thanks Mark. I will be using brand new rotors. Not sure if that changes things or not. Maybe I could get the initial steps of the bed in done on the street and then get the hard braking done at the track.

 

 

If you have a cloverleaf near you, and intersection of two main highways, that would be a good spot to get your brakes up to temp. Just keep getting on and off till they start smelling bad then take a ride down the road to cool them off. No need to kill the speed limit this way.

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n80

Got my new rotors and Carbotechs on the car. Did the bedding on some long, empty country roads. I spent all my money on new wheels and the brakes so I had to settle for some cheap tires rather than some Star Specs or RS-3s. But, they are at least a decent summer tire (Hankook Ventus V12 evos......$800 out the door). The bedding seemed to go fine.

 

These pads are something else. The previous EBC Yellows worked fine. They withstood 3 full track events plus 4 months of daily driving with no major issues. These Carbotechs are a whole other level. They stop the car so much faster and harder that I'm going to have to seriously relearn braking points, heel-toe, etc. If I can get it all sorted out they should seriously improve lap times. Going to CMP in 3 days.

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jimbow
These pads are something else. The previous EBC Yellows worked fine. They withstood 3 full track events plus 4 months of daily driving with no major issues. These Carbotechs are a whole other level. They stop the car so much faster and harder that I'm going to have to seriously relearn braking points, heel-toe, etc. If I can get it all sorted out they should seriously improve lap times. Going to CMP in 3 days.

 

I had "free" EBC Yellow pads on all four corners and they did not stop my car as good as xp10/8 combo.

I got them off the car as soon as I could and wrote my review. It was suposedly a "new" compund. Yea right - they stunk, I think Duralast gold pads would have been better.

 

Are you going to be at the Mustang club event?

If so I'll be out there instructing, maybe putting a session or two on my DD Camaro.

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