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JSG1901

RULE PROPOSAL: Require clearer class markings

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JSG1901

Modification to 7.1 GTS Logos and Car Classification Identification

 

Proposed change

Require clearer class markings on GTS cars. Specifically, markings which make it easy for both competitors and spectators to easily identify GTS cars running in the same class amid a field of mixed-class racers.

 

Reason

Much of the excitement of GTS racing comes from the close, hard-fought battles that happen on the track. Unfortunately, to enjoy these, you have to actually know the drivers involved as our current class markings are too hard to sort out by friends, families and spectators with an uninformed interest in our races.

 

Proposed wording

To be determined. A group discussion should determine the actual markings to be required, but they should certainly include the fore-and-aft 6" yellow class numbers. Possibly these should be required on the windows on all four sides of the car. Possibly colored banners across the windshield as we have encouraged in the past.

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tcdesign

Against rule, if a competitor has class markings you can't identify ask them to make them more clear. I am NOT in favor of requiring a windshield banner, that is prime advertizing space for me to use.

 

-Tony Colicchio

GTS-3

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todds

We have been using the 6" yellow letters in Great Lakes and it really helps, especially when racing with mixed regions when you do not recognize all the cars.

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mikew968

I am in favor of larger class markings. I never really thought the tape color on the windshield was much help...maybe that was because of the hit/miss use.

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kbrew8991

As a spectator watching Nats on Speedcast it was pretty tough to tell which cars were in each class and it got fairly confusing pretty quick. It'd be great to see something worked up to make this easier on fans.

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doclouns

Totally against the windshield banner. But a requirement that some kind of marking with a minimum size be on the windshield somewhere and on the rear window or rear somewhere is essential.

Edited by Guest

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bmwjoon

Sure, sounds like a no brainer. Requiring 4 - 6" number decals shouldn't bother anyone and should help reduce confusion.

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MPower6er

Absolutely Agree with this proposed rule change; with multi-class racing, difficult for spectators (who can help us ultimately grow the size of our classes) to understand which class cars are in. Additionally, we have similar cars running in different classes.

 

PD

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JoeMag

I agree with the bigger numbers or some way to tell class when approaching front and rear. ...not quite sure of the windshild banner. Could modify the banner to be a 1" stripe below normal top of windshield banner.

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Winefool

I think the requirements are fine as written, but they should be enforced. I see all kinds of GTS cars with no front or rear markings...

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KTL

Need to clarify the intent behind the rule change. Is it driver driven (pun intended) in that fellow drivers can't tell who's in what class, or is it fan driven?

 

Driver driven only seems to apply when crossover events occur. Otherwise everybody in-region seems to know who's who.

 

Fan driven is a different story. I tend to think a "standardized" number panel that incorporates the GTS logo and classing in the on the sides of the car would help with identifying car classing. Meaning, you have a

 

I agree that if we want to have a solid series we should have some "solidarity" with our class symbol & class number? Too many people have their own interpretation of GTS class identification

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corr

No to any windshield banner rule.

 

Yes, to common sense markings on sides or back of car.

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911.racer

Yes to clearer class markings.

 

But, do we really need a new rule to do this. How about just enforcing the wording we have now and get everyone to make sure that we have very clear markings.

 

Thanks

 

Ed

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CARVAL Motorsports

I really think that from a drivers perspective, fore and aft required class disignation of contrasting color in a simple block letter of 3" or 4" is plenty. I look for this number before trying to pick out a number off the windshield or rear glass, often obstructed by wing or sun glare.

With so many similar cars spread across 4-5 classes, the spectator is pretty much lost anyway. We need to help that situation out. Our small GTS graphic insignia is way to small, barely visible form the other side of the fence, needs improvement. The suggestion of standardized number plate could help, if all the cars were standardized in shape and size, so this doesn't work either, and generally leaves no room for those lucky enough to have sponsorship. I say, designate one area, common to all, fore or aft of either front or rear wheel and designate 4"-6" class ID, GTS included as we often run with other classes, easy read block lettering, no script. Maybe even on a white or black "BOX" that would further isolate and be easy to draw eye to.

 

Yes, look at this.

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KTL

My suggestion of standardization is not for car numbers. I know car numbers are part of a racer's car decor so I know that's off limits. I was suggesting a standardized GTS class panel, big enough to insert your class number in it. I was thinking the same thing- white or black panel/rectangle

 

Agreed the current GTS logo, while a very nice graphic, does little to accentuate the GTS-classed cars

 

I don't think a standardized area would work. The area designation is the same problem you described- different size & shape of cars doesn't lend itself to certain locations. IMO doors are the easiest target area since they're typically a big area. Front & rear fenders are tight on some cars. My front fenders are mostly hogged by big flares and don't have much vertical surface area. Same goes for the rear fenders

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Eric W.

The front/rear numbers are not required right now. In Mid-Atlantic, I try to get everyone running the yellow 6" #s on the windshield and rear of car.

 

I'd b for making that a requirement. The other class markings on front/rear and sides are already required in the CCRs.

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flink
I was thinking the same thing- white or black panel/rectangle

 

Please remember that quite a few people also race with BMWCCA, which already has a standard side-panel and requires the tirerack windshield banner. Fortunately NASA seem OK with the BMWCCA signage on there. Perhaps other (porsche?) clubs are similar. Having to swap the vinyl ten times per season would be quite painful!

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greuterm

I do not agree with a windshield panel as this space is used for advertising. The rear window on a 911 (996 model) is no area for another sticker. The wing spoiler used similar to cup cars already partially blocks a little bit of view. I also run in PCA and SCCA... 10" numbers and 4" class marking are used with them and I use with NASA. Not sure I like the idea of a yellow number.... prefer contrasting to the back ground of the car. Changing vinyl stickers of class is what I have to do for the various associations ( GTS, then SP996, then ITE). Don't like it but what I have to do... so I may buy a sticker company. I think all this says better enforce the current rules...

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Zach H.

In favor of enforcing the current rule set. However, I am very against making a window banner rule. I am negotiating my 2013 contract and it includes using the window banner use for advertising.

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Brad Waite

I agree in concept. Whatever the solution for clearer identification, I support.

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Winefool
The front/rear numbers are not required right now. In Mid-Atlantic, I try to get everyone running the yellow 6" #s on the windshield and rear of car.

 

I'd b for making that a requirement. The other class markings on front/rear and sides are already required in the CCRs.

 

From the GTS 2012 Rule book:

'All cars will display their class number, either in conjunction with the GTS logo, or other

markings indicating the Series. Class identification is required on both sides of the car,

as well as fore and aft.'

 

It may not be enforced in MA (or anywhere else), but it is a rule.

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scottbm3
The front/rear numbers are not required right now. In Mid-Atlantic, I try to get everyone running the yellow 6" #s on the windshield and rear of car.

 

I'd b for making that a requirement. The other class markings on front/rear and sides are already required in the CCRs.

 

From the GTS 2012 Rule book:

'All cars will display their class number, either in conjunction with the GTS logo, or other

markings indicating the Series. Class identification is required on both sides of the car,

as well as fore and aft.'

 

It may not be enforced in MA (or anywhere else), but it is a rule.

 

Chris,

 

I think Eric's referring to the bigger yellow numbers a lot of us run on the front and rear.

 

 

-Scott B.

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cstreit911

Agree with this. There were cars at Nationals that passed scrutineering that I had NO idea what class they were in. Yellow numbers on a green field, various other groups numbers all over the place... I don't have time out there to consult "Nasa's field guide to identifying a cars class".

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KTL

I certainly understand that several people run with other organizations. But that's your choice to do so. IMO i'd prefer not to see one diminish NASA's organization by your personal issue with changing class markings or whatever. Having various class designations, some of which are not applicable to NASA classing, can make a car a clutter of lettering. That makes it difficult to pick out the classing if your GTS classing is not very prominent on the car. Just my opinion.

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