evojim Posted May 15, 2013 Share Posted May 15, 2013 At a certain point it becomes hp vs aero, not weight, in acceleration though. I think a lot of folks don't consider this, this is absolutely true, and on a car with aero, I think folks would be surprised at how "slow" of speed that crossover point is. Believe me, I drive a shoebox that when it is running right at least stays in the ballpark of the C5z's for the first half of that back straight at Road Atl, then exactly ^this takes effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trigger Posted May 17, 2013 Author Share Posted May 17, 2013 Terry, I think your on to something with the C6 idea. Think gran sport. its the Z06 widebody that can stuff 345's under it, weights in at 3300lbs, and has the LS3, which puts 385ish at the wheels in stock trim. ~3500lbs/385whp = 9.09. add pimp suspension and stir around track. that would be a killer recipe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra4B Posted May 17, 2013 Share Posted May 17, 2013 Detuned C6Z is interesting also. This I don't think people realize the strength of the C5/C6 isn't the car itself (yes they are an excellent platform out of the box). Where it shines is the aftermarket, massive "toy" stores of real race parts. Not ebay wings and splitters, we are talking real world ALMS Factory, Europe GT, World Challenge/Grand Am bits - carbon bodies, real aero, suspension bits, and fairly accessible data from established race teams. I would say you could probably rival all that with the 911 race car variants, but you are talking a three fold increase in price. Stop giving away our secrets You'd have to really choke a C6Z to get in in TT3/ST3. A local member recently built one for ST2/TT2. Car has no aero and the engine is 100% OEM stock (paper filter) and the car has ballast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varkwso Posted May 17, 2013 Share Posted May 17, 2013 Detuned C6Z is interesting also. This I don't think people realize the strength of the C5/C6 isn't the car itself (yes they are an excellent platform out of the box). Where it shines is the aftermarket, massive "toy" stores of real race parts. Not ebay wings and splitters, we are talking real world ALMS Factory, Europe GT, World Challenge/Grand Am bits - carbon bodies, real aero, suspension bits, and fairly accessible data from established race teams. I would say you could probably rival all that with the 911 race car variants, but you are talking a three fold increase in price. Stop giving away our secrets You'd have to really choke a C6Z to get in in TT3/ST3. A local member recently built one for ST2/TT2. Car has no aero and the engine is 100% OEM stock (paper filter) and the car has ballast. I saw the dyno sheet on one. I like the torque curve. Alot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnoXRacer183 Posted May 17, 2013 Share Posted May 17, 2013 (edited) I'd like to think a 350Z would do alright if properly set up for TT3 Turbo motor with 380whp or so which would be a reliable HP set up 3300 lbs with Aero I haven't been around NASA very long at all but with a good driver I'd like to think it would be competitive Edited May 17, 2013 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted May 17, 2013 Share Posted May 17, 2013 Swap out the turbo for an SC and that's similar to the other NASA-TX TT directors car. Quite a few old TTS records Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnoXRacer183 Posted May 18, 2013 Share Posted May 18, 2013 Swap out the turbo for an SC and that's similar to the other NASA-TX TT directors car. Quite a few old TTS records Good to know! I hope to be going this route as soon as my Cobra sells. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted May 19, 2013 Share Posted May 19, 2013 I'd ping him and see what he'd share as far as "I wish I did it that way first" or "definitely don't do that!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varkwso Posted May 19, 2013 Share Posted May 19, 2013 The 350/370Z did not.fare to well in TTA/PTA in southeast against C5. The Spec 350Z is sure not equal to the old C5 PTA. But it may be developed better now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trigger Posted May 21, 2013 Author Share Posted May 21, 2013 its hard to beat balanced weight on double wishbone suspension (vs struts), a slippery body, and fenders wide enough for 315/335 tires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoBoyR6 Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 Sitting here drinking my kool-aid, I'm hoping someone will say E46 M3 How have you been doing with your E46M3...since your sig says you're running TT3/2/1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockLobster Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 I'll play... 2851 lbs RX-8, OEM aero Turbocharged 13B 353 WHP flat dyno curve with electronic boost control for bleeding boost with RPM 4 doors +0.4 2-Rotor turbo +0.3 275 A6s +0.4 weight adj -0.15 9.02:1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 RX8 does not get the 4 door credit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockLobster Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 where does it say that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 Greg himself since day 1 of the 4-door hp/weight credit I don't particularly like it as it would benefit me (well, benefit my "crap, the racecar's down so lets run the fun street car effort anyway) but that's what it is. And honestly, it doesn't really deserve it as much as some other cars that should get the credit but don't (namely 3 door wagon style hatchbacks...). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockLobster Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 (edited) It's not in the rules... Ive had this argument with another national director about the unwritten rules. While it may impact guys at nationals if you don't put it in the rules it does not apply to my region... we cant arbitrarily enforce emailed rule clarifications... so he should probably make a bulletin (and add it to the next version) if he wants it enforced nation wide Edited June 6, 2013 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 I'd be for a notation with every car's listing in the TT rules if it qualifies for the 4 door credit or not. That'd allow us to possibly more equitably apply it as well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockLobster Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 That would make sense to me.... The big problem for me is standing in the tech area face to face with a driver who is all mad about something and i cant point to anything in the rule book(s) to back up what im saying. I simply won't do it.... If it has feathers, webbed feet, waddles, and quacks....it's a 4-door....or something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 Except this is really a case where a real 4 door quacks, waddles, has feathers, etc and the RX8 really only has feathers The shape it has the car really doesn't *need* the 4-door credit. It's plenty slippery as is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockLobster Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 well, until i can point to something in a rule book, i can't enforce it... the notation would be a little awkward being its probably more common to have 2 and 4 door options for the same base class. AAAAND....the ST rules have no such reference...so it probably needs to be an apendix list of 4-door cars that are 2-doors in the eyes of the rules or whatever... I wont argue with your point that it does not need it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 You could really stir up some crap if you want to point out that some 4-door cars actually have better aero than their 2-door counterparts due to the smaller window opening since you could leave the back windows rolled up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockLobster Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 Personally i never figured it was an aero thing (the 4-door deal) i always just assumed it was for lower body rigidity (which is not necessarily the case with a roll cage and/or smaller actual door openings, being there is a substantial B-pillar enforcement). I dunno, at face value i never really fully understood the intent of the rule, but w/e... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trigger Posted June 7, 2013 Author Share Posted June 7, 2013 personally I would just LSX the RX8. same power from an LS6 and flat TQ. and you can do all your sessions, vice fiddling with a broken rotary in the pits. also 2851lbs is a lot of weight for 275's. considering the C5 mafia is on 315s or 335's with only a few hundred more pounds, and the turbo or V8 miatas are on the same 275's and a few hundred pounds less. I like the boost bleed idea though. tune for a flat power curve. 350HP at every RPM. DAGUM. the rally cars do this dont they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted June 7, 2013 Share Posted June 7, 2013 (edited) Oh how quickly we forget the TTA Corvette guys on 275s, then 255s, then 245s and ever the whole time going faster also going to pistons in that car you lose the credit for the rotary... they've been out for long enough they can be solid if you stay disciplined and keep away from the go-fast knob. Edited June 7, 2013 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockLobster Posted June 7, 2013 Share Posted June 7, 2013 Well without the 4-door allowance the RX-8 loses it's luster for me. Id rather just use an MX-5 or FD RX-7 chassis. Smaller frontal area, better aero, etc... don't get me wrong the RX-8 is an outstanding chassis but bulkier than its smaller forbearers. It's all still an uphill battle against the bowties...because greg thinks all mazdas are cheater from the factory Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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