2015 Spec Iron Rule Changes

[68Cobra]

Where are we on the rule changes for next season's Spec Iron cars? I responded to a Facebook thread a few weeks ago, but I'm sure that's not going to be the extent of our input? Facebook doesn't reach everyone. I'll kick off my ideas here & see what you think:

 

1. No changes to minimum weight- 3350.

2. Drop the 53.5% front weight requirement. Too hard to police with the scales in the field.

3. One tune/tuner for all cars. See if FORD will make one for us.

4. Hp/Tq- no changes to the current 11.75/11.25. Add weight accordingly.

5. One set of Ford Racing shocks, springs, sway bars. No variables. Spec means SPEC.

6. One rear end ratio. My vote- 3:73, but don't mind the 3:31 if that's what's decided. SPEC

 

Ok, I've kicked the ball onto the field... what do YOU think?

 

James Ray

#68 NASA-SE Spec Iron

[SNAKBITN]

Get rid of the 53.5%.Like James said,to hard to really police and if you install a fuel cell you'll never make that without adding A LOT of weight to the front.

Open up tuning with any after market one.These engines don't make but so much and all seem to be with in 10 hp.They can't police it so why have it.

Keep the power to weight but get rid of the tq.These are stock engines.Seems like we all have to weight the car based on tq instead of hp.Make it easy!

Allow road race oil pans.Ford made one so they saw a need for it at one time and it could save a engine.

I like the suspension requirements as is.If I can make the car handle better with a different sway bar and set of springs why not?You've only got a few combo's to choose from anyway's.

As far as the rear end gear I'd prefer the 3:31's.It would be cheaper on new guy's coming to SI and that's the way most of them came,but doesn't really matter to me.

 

And let me add this,The Spec Iron series as a whole is great and I look forward to running in it for years.The costs will come down as the cars get a little older and it's V8 mustangs!What else can you ask for.The racing is close as the Championships proved and the competition will only get better.

[larsend]

Here's my take.

 

Suspension Basics:

 

Caster/Camber Plates: Keep as written.

 

Dampeners: Keep the HVT dampeners all but a few cars all ready have them.

 

Springs: If we want to go with a "SPEC" spring rates for the HVT dampeners, 800 lbs upfront, 350 lbs in the rear.

 

Sway bars: The Ford Racing Kit is OK in the front but WAY to much rear bar. Change to rule to allow the 22.0 mm solid stabilizer bar from the V6's or no rear bar at all (this should be a driver preference) and that's it for sway bars.

 

Keep all the other bits as optional that way folks can build out the car to the max allowable in the rules over time.

 

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Drive line:

 

Pick ONE rear end ratio. My vote is the 3:73

 

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I've made up my top three requests for rule changes and attached links to Google doc for everyone's viewing pleasure.

 

RCR - Spec Iron - ABS Module

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Bew4k_PLnxrLnCrJzbMFKt5NlVguF1bHuqy6QdfSzRs/edit?usp=sharing

 

RCR - Spec Iron - Canton Oil Pan

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1R9HmP0laa0VShM_QneRNF4iFQq3fB_vid4yW4WPJ_7k/edit?usp=sharing

 

RCR - Spec Iron - FR 3V Control Pack

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1aF2pYcWENNSYNi2zX6V7zKUHKOlbAdGnCPCdgSk3NS4/edit?usp=sharing

 

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While at the Nationals this year as a spectator with eye as a future competitor.............

 

I was a bit dismayed at the tech "inspections" NOT the inspectors they did the best they could with the crappy as written rules for ride height.

 

The inspectors were measuring not on the rocker panel but on the floor pan.

 

We need to change the rules on how the ride height is measured for our class.

 

Example; Each car will have two holes drilled into the plastic rocker cover; (1) 6 inches from the leading edge of the cover and (2) 6 inches from the trailing edge of the cover. These holes will be used to insert a "calibrated stick" that measures X.

 

The distance is only an example we would have to determine the exact distance and the exact length of the "calibrated stick" or sticks to ensure the desired minimum ride height is met.

 

Pictures can be taken to illustrate where the holes are

 

So flame on............

[SNAKBITN]

Any sway bar can be used now as long as it's oem from 05 though 10 gt.

[olaaf]

For what it’s worth, I think we should consider 2 core factors when proposing rule changes:

 

1- Will it make the cars less expensive to run/build?

2- Will it increase car counts?

 

I think anything that does number 1, will do 2? I’m new to this game, but I’m starting to wonder if an “expensive” spec car doesn’t work? Look at Spec Z (low car counts) Spec E46 (brand new, but if I’m right, it will be a low car count series) compared to Spec E30 and Spec Miata. The outlier would be Spec Focus I guess. Any other comparisons I’m missing?

 

So, what can we do as a group to make this class succeed? I’m the only car in the NE, and it certainly looks to stay that way. The #2 car at the nationals put his car up for sale, and I know of one other SI car converting to AI spec.

 

Should nothing be changed? Can we convince Ford to pay out bigger amounts for regional races? What can we, NASA, or Ford do to get more SI cars built?

 

I’m almost starting to regret the RCR’s I submitted (ducted quarter windows, any trans cooler, slotted rotors, and forced air cooling of the brakes).

 

Anything to keep the costs down for existing cars would be appreciated.. I personally really don’t want to change springs, I went with the HVT recommended 600/350 and that seems to work well- changing these would make spend testing time re-developing the handling. I also went with 3.73’s. Opening up tuning would negate the gears- I would certainly keep the 3.73’s and change the rev limiter to 7000 if tuning was open. On the other hand, I now doubt that NASA has the ability and tech know-how to police ECU tunes.

[stevepoe]

Springs: If we want to go with a "SPEC" spring rates for the HVT dampeners, 800 lbs upfront, 350 lbs in the rear.

 

800 I would still like to drive my car .

 

[snakebit]

Here are my thoughts, in order of importance.

 

1) Allow road race oil pan, and billet gear oil pumps.

2) NO spec spring. We spent a lot of money on the HVT's and I like the fact that I can use their adjustability with different springs for different tracks. If they wanted a "spec" spring, we should've had a spec "spring/non-adjustable shock/sway bar package" from day one....not now.

3) Allow all 05-10 factory Mustang sway bars. Coupe and convertible, V6 GT and GT500.

4) Drop torque rule or change to 11.0 to 1

5) Eliminate 53.5% rule

 

Spec gear choice 3.31, but I like to have choices.

If the powers that be just have to add more spec parts, then spec the GT500 wheel.

 

John

[suck fumes]

Springs: If we want to go with a "SPEC" spring rates for the HVT dampeners, 800 lbs upfront, 350 lbs in the rear.

 

800 I would still like to drive my car .

 

 

DITTO!!! 800/350 is insane!

 

And costs can already be cut by not buying the HVT kit. The car is just as fast and easier on tires running stock shocks new out of the box for $100/set. I personally would like to see everyone on the same stuff....shocks (whatever that may be), gears (3:31 req. less shifting), all have to run ford bars (if they suck then we all are on the same playing field), and finally Ford needs to give us a race tune not a street tune that makes the car run way to lean which is what we have now being offered. We even called ford racing and they told us straight up not to run our allowed tuner on a racecar! What does that tell you??

[bojets]

And costs can already be cut by not buying the HVT kit the only problem with that is so many people already spent the money to buy the kit and spent time and money testing

[SNAKBITN]

Any progress on this yet?

[cash canada]

Add Aftermarket oil pan as this is allowed in CMC and promotes engine life which reduces cost.

 

Keep Rear Gear options as original 3.31 3.55 3.73 as I have already invested in two of these per rules

 

Keep Shocks as is as I have already invested in these per rules

 

Allow change in weight % as this seems to be an issue for those more informed than me

 

Allow any tune as the Ford tune is "problematic" and we already have a power to weight ratio

 

Cash

[Marshall M.]

The three requests below are the only official requests being considered:

 

 

RCR - Spec Iron - ABS Module

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Bew4k_PLnxrLnCrJzbMFKt5NlVguF1bHuqy6QdfSzRs/edit?usp=sharing

 

RCR - Spec Iron - Canton Oil Pan

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1R9HmP0laa0VShM_QneRNF4iFQq3fB_vid4yW4WPJ_7k/edit?usp=sharing

 

RCR - Spec Iron - FR 3V Control Pack

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1aF2pYcWENNSYNi2zX6V7zKUHKOlbAdGnCPCdgSk3NS4/edit?usp=sharing

[SNAKBITN]

I sent Todd and Al Watson an email on RCR request's before the championship race at RA.Why are those not being considered?If there's something I'm missing here let me know and I will fix or resend the email.

[Al Watson]

Robert. I received your rcrs. They have been forwarded to the AI leadership. We have them. However as you know we tried a new RCR procedure last year, the regional directors worked on them all year long, we got them done and out on time to the higher ups but unfortunately they sat and sat and were late again. So we are not sure how Todd plans to handle them this year but we have them. Thanks, AL.

[Marshall M.]

RCR - Spec Iron - FR 3V Control Pack

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1aF2pYcWENNSYNi2zX6V7zKUHKOlbAdGnCPCdgSk3NS4/edit?usp=sharing

 

This is intended for installing 4.6 3V engines into older chassis. It

requires a return-less fuel system, so it will not work on an

otherwise stock S197 saddle tank setup.

[larsend]

RCR - Spec Iron - FR 3V Control Pack

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1aF2pYcWENNSYNi2zX6V7zKUHKOlbAdGnCPCdgSk3NS4/edit?usp=sharing

 

This is intended for installing 4.6 3V engines into older chassis. It

requires a return-less fuel system, so it will not work on an

otherwise stock S197 saddle tank setup.

 

It will work in a 2005-2010 Mustang chassis with the saddle tank.............it will also allow folks without a complete donor vehicle to build a car.

[Marshall M.]

RCR - Spec Iron - FR 3V Control Pack

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1aF2pYcWENNSYNi2zX6V7zKUHKOlbAdGnCPCdgSk3NS4/edit?usp=sharing

 

This is intended for installing 4.6 3V engines into older chassis. It

requires a return-less fuel system, so it will not work on an

otherwise stock S197 saddle tank setup.

 

It will work in a 2005-2010 Mustang chassis with the saddle tank.............it will also allow folks without a complete donor vehicle to build a car.

 

 

I will discuss further with Al F.

[Al Watson]

2015 rule package update:

 

Your regional directors apologize for yet another delay in the rule package. Will Faules is temporarily overseeing the process and your regional directors will be getting a rule package to him for approval based on the timeline below. If you have an RCR please submit asap. Currently we have 7 SI, 2 AI and 1 AIX RCRs to address. All appear to be minor.

 

Thank you, AL Watson.

 

 

11/28/14 - deadline for RCRs. no RCRs after this point.

12/12/14 - RCR discussion done and marked up rulebook to Nasa HQ.

12/19/14 - Nasa to approve and publish rulebook online.

[Ed M.]

Thanks Al! You da man!!

 

Ed

[stevepoe]

It will work in a 2005-2010 Mustang chassis with the saddle tank.............it will also allow folks without a complete donor vehicle to build a car

 

so what do you plan to do about abs if you run this stand alone harness ? It doesn't have abs in it ..... rules don't allow for a bp valve in line so your bias is going to be pretty scary .... or do you plan to go through all the trouble of cutting down a stock harness to remove the abs system out of it and wire it as stand alone .