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NASA 2018 ST1-4 & SU Rules Released 11-29-17


Greg G.
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Still seeking dimensional clarity on the NSW tool.

Based on the ST Rules for 2018 I made the toolset but having the depth dimension specifically called out will probably require cutting another set.

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Still seeking dimensional clarity on the NSW tool.

Based on the ST Rules for 2018 I made the toolset but having the depth dimension specifically called out will probably require cutting another set.

Tom, the templates are to scale, and if you printed them out to scale, the depth should be correct (if not, then someone needs to let us know, because we found they are). As well, the depths are in the rules in both print and on the diagram(s) regarding NSW.

 

From ST5 Rules:

"A tire's NASA Section Width is the measurement of the tire's width from its inner sidewall to its outer sidewall using the NASA Section Width tire measurement tool(s) (excluding any protective ribs, decorations or raised letters) at the point 30mm deep to the tread surface on a new tire for vehicles 2400 lbs. or greater, and 23mm deep to the tread surface for vehicles less than 2400 lbs."

 

From ST1-4 Rules:

"A tire's NASA Section Width is the measurement of the tire's width from its inner sidewall to its outer sidewall using the NASA Section Width tire measurement tool(s) (excluding any protective ribs, decorations or raised letters) at the point 30mm deep to the tread surface on a new tire."

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Thanks Greg.

For St5 I see there is a weight criteria. Is that Empty Weight or Minimum Competition Weight?

 

The drawing is great, just that it is inaccurate to measure with paper, so I had them waterjet cut in a 30mm depth, hoping that is right.

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Thanks Greg.

For St5 I see there is a weight criteria. Is that Empty Weight or Minimum Competition Weight?

 

The drawing is great, just that it is inaccurate to measure with paper, so I had them waterjet cut in a 30mm depth, hoping that is right.

Minimum Comp. Weight.

 

It is written that way because of this:

"3) Size

 

1) Vehicles with a Minimum Competition Weight greater than 2749 lbs. must

have a measured tire NASA Section Width equal to or less than 266mm.

(note: Most currently produced size 245 tires should fit within this

measurement range on manufactured recommended wheel sizes)

 

2) Vehicles with a Minimum Competition Weight between 2749 lbs. and

2400 lbs. must have a measured tire NASA Section Width equal to or less than 257mm.

(note: Most currently produced size 225 tires should fit within this

measurement range on manufactured recommended wheel sizes)

 

3) Vehicles with a Minimum Competition Weight less than 2400 lbs. must have

a measured tire NASA Section Width equal to or less than 226mm.

(note: Most currently produced size 205 tires should fit within this

measurement range on manufactured recommended wheel sizes)"

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This is a 245-40/17 A7 mounted on a 17*9.5

FYI, I tested the same tire in an R7 on an Apex ARC-8 17x9.5" yesterday with the 266 (x 30) tool, and it failed by about 1-2mm.

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This is a 245-40/17 A7 mounted on a 17*9.5

FYI, I tested the same tire in an R7 on an Apex ARC-8 17x9.5" yesterday with the 266 (x 30) tool, and it failed by about 1-2mm.

Correction, my waterjet cut the depth wrong.

New set on the table being spooled up now.

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I haven't measured a 225, but I did measure a used 245/45R17 A7 on RPF01 17x9. I set the tire down on the ground, put a ruler over it and measured so its not to NASA rules but it should be the widest point. I got 10.437 inches, 265.1125mm.

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This is a 245-40/17 A7 mounted on a 17*9.5

FYI, I tested the same tire in an R7 on an Apex ARC-8 17x9.5" yesterday with the 266 (x 30) tool, and it failed by about 1-2mm.

I tested the 245-40/17 R7 on an Apex ARC-8 17x9" wheel today, and it fits the 266 (x 30) NSW tool (just barely). The date code on the tire was 2317.

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the first Tire Template I cut out, it scaled correctly in the long direction, but incorrectly in the short direct. PDF files can be very tricky. Confirm your dimension before and after you print/cut.

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  • 4 weeks later...
I would consider my motor to be tuned correctly and its peaky. In regards to small displacement turbo motors if you are making low power than I can see a pretty flat power curve but if you are looking at 500whp than it will be fairly peaky. Seems like to many variables to throw FI into that rule.

Maybe your prepping for the wrong class, then? Your choice. But, your specific case is not how we write rules. They are written for the possibilities. And, I know that there have been race gas powered small displacement turbo engines making well over 500whp that could be detuned to a flat dyno curve in the usable range even at 500 Avg HP.

 

The problem is you wrote the average hp rules to prevent a few cheaters from cheating, not in the spirit of competition per:

 

2) Intent

The intent of these rules is to provide mandates to ensure that all Super Touring vehicles are modified within clearly established limits to strive for an even platform in which a contest of driving skill may provide the most talented drivers with great rewards. The rules shall be applied in a logical manner that seeks to provide competitors a safe and fair venue for competition, without a constrained interpretation of the rules based on phraseology or verbiage.

 

Everything done over the past 2-3 seasons for average hp has been great, but this year's iteration is an absolute violation of the Intent in my opinion and the opinion of my new average hp calculations.

 

Also, having to measure tire width with a template is absolutely over the top, despite the widely varying manufacturer specs. Just set a size range / limit to each penalty for each manufacturer. I'm a retired USAF Senior NCO and I've read, written, and taught a ton of regulations including ones that have way too much regulation in them and this rule set has crossed that line, not only in overly complex rules, but by doing so, negated paragraph #2, which should have been the guide for everything that follows it. Per paragraph 2, the rules are to be written to provide a fair playing field, not to prevent cheating and dyno manipulation. All you had to do was write something like, "Unnatural (non-climbing) dyno curve manipulation with boost maps is a violation of the Sportsmanship clause, and can result in disqualification" or whatever needs to be said to get the point across. Cheaters don't care about the rules, that's why they're cheaters.

 

This is further exacerbated by the fact that there's still a 4-door provision and a full point for FWD. Both are absurd penalties / bonuses that are not appropriate for BOP. An RS3 LMS on DOTs is ST3, but it is as fast as an ST1 car thanks to the 4-door, FWD bonuses. That is not an even platform. Another violation of the Intent.

 

Sorry, but I sent an email almost 2 months ago asking this to be addressed directly before involving the community, not just for me, but anyone who has been negatively affected in an unfair manner by the new average hp debacle. My now ST2 car per the new rules is 6-8 seconds slower than an ST3 legal car, per the new rules solely because of the new dyno calculations. If things were the same as last year, it would've been an evenly competitive ST3 car as it should be. No response from Greg so I sold my race car last week. Thanks!

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