Glenn Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 (edited) .... Edited May 26, 2006 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 What's wrong with the 3rd gen GTA's? At ~17lbs, tested on the track over the years, they seem to be a good choice - with great offsets to boot! I know that absolute dollar amounts in the rulebooks have their drawbacks, but maybe a concrete number for a set of wheels rather than some "interpretable" wording would be helpful. Obviously, weight, strength and cost are the main tradeoffs here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsim Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 I'm just as vain Glenn - although the stock salad shooters are cheap and light, I'd like something to be cheap and light AND cool looking. Or at least not spin one way on one side of the car, and the opposite way on the other. I looked for good 16x8 wheels starting about 3 years ago, and found it's tough to find 16" anymore, what with the 'big wheel' trend and all. There's a TON of cool 17's or 15's though. In all my looking, everyone kept pointing me back to the GTA wheels. I'm still interested in getting something else (I'm quite fond of the Kosei K1), but I'd be hard pressed to want to spend more than $600 a set, and they'd have to be lighter than the shooters. Maybe I'm too critical, but I never did find any... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsim Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 Kieth, I don't think the rules are overly interpretable - there's no cost limit on wheels. Other than NOT being modular, aren't the wheels rules open? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted August 8, 2005 Author Share Posted August 8, 2005 (edited) .... Edited May 26, 2006 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted August 8, 2005 Author Share Posted August 8, 2005 (edited) ..... Edited May 26, 2006 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony G Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 Non exotic means what it means if your buying wheels that cost $600 each and weigh 12 lbs than thats exotic since I dont see those running around much on the frwy( just like 427 Cobras). We will clean up the wheel rule this year but stick with wheels that are more the norm of 17-20lbs and no more than $800 for the set for now please,since that is what I expect to see for next years rule on this..maybe. Anyway there are several aftermarket ZR1 wheels 16X8 on the market for $99 each and look really good too. CMC is simple..keep it that way with you check book too,and spend the extra money on yourself not some super high dollar wheels that won't make you any faster. My opinion at least. Tony Guaglione Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 ...that's what I was trying not to say... exotic is up to the reader to determine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 BTW - you can get cheap ZR1 replicas in tons of sizes and offsets over at tires.com . I ran those replicas when I ran AI. Pairing the Chinese manufacturing stamps on those wheels with the number of wheel failures I've seen with supposedly quality aftermarket wheels, I decided to go with GM wheels this time because a wheel failure is a scary proposition (which I why I said tested above). Maybe I'm just paranoid... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony G Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 Right Keith, on your statements above,so we will be re-writing the rule to make it a bit more understanding. So I make this statement here and now..question on the wheels you are buying..call any director first before you jump into someting that is not quite legal. Thanks for understanding everyone,as there are still some rules that we find every year that need some tweaking. Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted August 8, 2005 Author Share Posted August 8, 2005 (edited) ..... Edited May 26, 2006 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony G Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 My answer is: You simply don't get it. I'm protecting the series from the want to be over spenders for nothing which is the way the series started and we will never deviate from this point, and I mean never, that is my job.. protecting you from the series going from number one to number zero and I've seen it happen many times in other great classes that dont exist anymore. Like it or not that is the way it is. There is a class for those who do want to spend lots of money which is great, but its not this one. Trust me on this from 20 years of being around this stuff. Tony Guaglione Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffburch Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 I'm with TG on the ZR1. High Polish. BLING! jb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Matt1548534716 Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 Volk TE-37s are another possibility if you have the budget, unless being made in Japan constitutes "exotic" construction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted August 8, 2005 Author Share Posted August 8, 2005 (edited) ..... Edited May 26, 2006 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsim Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 I read this: 8.34. Wheels/Tires 8.34.1. All cars may use up to a maximum size 16"x 8" rim of one piece or two piece welded (non-exotic) construction. to say: 1 or 2 piece (simple!), NON-modular (ala BBS), and if they ARE 2 piece, they need to be WELDED wheels, not bolted, screwed, glued or nailed, nor any of the preceding 'welded' in my garage. Now, if I wanna spend $3,000 per 15# wheel (legally), I should be able to. Although if you wanna spend a ton of money on wheels to save 1-2 lbs (IF THAT MUCH) and look cool, maybe we should all get Honda's and change the "C" to Civic. Hey wait, "Civic Mack'in Challenge! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Well, my opinion is that $$$ limits are tough - it ends up like the GRM $2002 challenge and you can get your buddy to sell you used wheels for $1 - wink, wink. I look at those supposed $2000 cars and just chuckle. However, I also understand the intent here and I believe that in this instance, these GTA wheels are the right answer for f-bodies but they are getting more expensive for the same reason. To me, weight is huge on our cars and to reduce the rotating mass is one of the best legal mods out there. I don't have a real answer on this one and this is why I posted that a $$$ limit may be a solution - with all of the trappings that come with it. I just don't know, Glenn. I do know that the selection of wheels is important. With no real other mods to my car except a restrictor plate, smaller tires and these wheels, I got FASTER lap times at my home track. Seat time? Yeah, some. But I didn't just fall off the "banana boat" into CMC... My old wheels were 26lbs and these are 17lbs. I just love 'em to death. ...and as purdy as my car is, this is completely by accident. I think those wheels look better than the ZR-1's. Here's a link with the 3rd gens: http://community.webshots.com/album/204150902MeTWkd and a link with the ZR-1's: http://community.webshots.com/album/99139056uKfrSV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tacovini Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Saving 2-3 pounds per wheel in unsprung weight can/will equate to a ~1 second advantage in lap times. The most outspoken guys here will be the first to complain when the guy with $2500 wheels checks out and can not be beaten (unless they buy the same wheels). CMC is not checkbook racing...the only way to assure an equal field is to make sure everyone has access to the same parts within the price range of reasonableness. Since everyone has their own "range of reasonableness" the directors must collective decide what that is for the group. Remember, we're trying to look out for the group as a whole. Sorry guys...there's always AI if that doesn't work...and AIX if "the sky is the limit". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffburch Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Keith, what's with the NOPI "Type R" stickers? jb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted August 9, 2005 Author Share Posted August 9, 2005 (edited) .... Edited May 26, 2006 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Al F. Posted August 9, 2005 Members Share Posted August 9, 2005 There are tons of good quality wheels that can be found for much less than $200 a piece, brand new. Used OEM style wheels can be found for under $200 a set all the time. That's the kind of wheel this rule has always intended. This isn't Tony flying off the handle. If you want to spend money...well, I guess you should go right out and do so, as long as it doesnt actually make the car faster (just like Nick and his shiny new yellow paint job! ). Personally, my suggestion to the rest of the board is to set a weight minimum for wheels around 16 or 17lbs and move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Keith, what's with the NOPI "Type R" stickers? jb Jeff - the story about the Type-R stickers is this. A number of years back, I had a black Z28 and a local guy I ran with on lapping days/autocrosses had a black Type-R Integra. On the track, our laps times were about even - I'd pull on the straightaways and he'd stomp me in the turns. We had a running joke that if I had the Type-R stickers on my car like his stickers, I could probably pull away. Well, I sold that car and finally found Type-R stickers by the time I started in AI. I put them on the car and e-mailed the pictures to the guy (he moved to Florida). As it turns out, he is now a journalist for Grassroots Motorsports and still thinks the stickers are hilarious. ...this is why my car was in the latest issue of GRM... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitchntx1548534714 Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Matt1548534716 Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Used OEM style wheels can be found for under $200 a set all the time. That's the kind of wheel this rule has always intended. Oh really? Name one for a Mustang please. If this rule change goes into effect it will be a huge advantage to the GM racers who have the option to run GTA wheels. Nothing even close exists for the Mustangs. On edit: As has been pointed out by others in this thread, while the intent of the directors is clear, it's just unreasonable to expect that a rule set can be written that will prevent people from finding ways to spend money on perceived advantages. And as has been stated ad nauseum, we all know that even a seemingly huge mechanical advantage can be negated by superior driving at this level of racing. Setting a weight or price limit on wheels is not the answer. What if someone shows up with some wheel no one has seen before. Will they have to dismount it and scale it prove it's legal? Several of us Mustang guys are running wheels that are no longer in production but still meet the letter of the current rules. How will those be treated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y5e06 Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 i'm getting tired of the look of my car Why not just paint them? makes a world of difference, just tape off the machined edge to leave nice and shiney (look much better than the pic, as they are dirty here) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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