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wastntim

RCR - engine choice

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Glenn
Keep in mind that was the reason for allowing the S197, because guys with them wanted to race with us. Look what that got us.

 

I think it is more than a stretch to compare allowing an LS1 in a third gen to allowing in a S197. First, both the third gen and the LS1 are already allowed in under the rules. Only the combination of the two is currently not allowed in the rules. Second, the S197 was a completely new car, with new technology that was untested within the series. This problem exists for neither the third gen nor the LS1. Third, under the horsepower restrictions, the third gens can gain no advantage over the fourth gens or the mustangs.

 

I find it funny that anyone could somehow draw a conclusion that a third gen would somehow have an advantage over other cars or generations by being able to run the same motor that the fourth gens, a car which has arguably better technology and is superior to, already run.

 

You missed the point.

The point was about changing the rules to allow platforms/combinations that are currently not legal because they want to race with us. Not a good reason to change the rules.

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soundguydave1548534741
Keep in mind that was the reason for allowing the S197, because guys with them wanted to race with us. Look what that got us.

 

I think it is more than a stretch to compare allowing an LS1 in a third gen to allowing in a S197. First, both the third gen and the LS1 are already allowed in under the rules. Only the combination of the two is currently not allowed in the rules. Second, the S197 was a completely new car, with new technology that was untested within the series. This problem exists for neither the third gen nor the LS1. Third, under the horsepower restrictions, the third gens can gain no advantage over the fourth gens or the mustangs.

 

I find it funny that anyone could somehow draw a conclusion that a third gen would somehow have an advantage over other cars or generations by being able to run the same motor that the fourth gens, a car which has arguably better technology and is superior to, already run.

 

You missed the point.

The point was about changing the rules to allow platforms/combinations that are currently not legal because they want to race with us. Not a good reason to change the rules.

 

Glenn, I'm not 100% positive, but I think Robert is talking about current series participants, not potential newbies...

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Glenn

Got it. Texting and driving.......

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wastntim
Where the advantage comes into play is where the motor sits in the car. ".

 

To quote a wise man I know, "So what you are saying is where the weight is has an impact on the result?....Hmmm, thought I read that wasn't a big deal."

 

Although, I do not know what the exact difference is in placement, it's clear that no one here knows either. Many people are speculating that it is substantially improved but this does not seem logical in that the stock third gen K member can be used, therefore, the engine placement has to be very similar to stock placement.

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suck fumes1548534743

It doesn't matter when it's 2pds but when an entire engine sits even a few inches in a different place THAT matters.

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Steve91T

LS engines into LT cars isn't bad. You do have to use an LS K member though. Shouldn't be too hard to find though.

 

I personally will be using a 5.3 iron block if/when my LT1 lets go. Or, I might just sell the LT1 and see if I can find a screaming deal on a 5.3 and do it right from the start, especially since the car isn't track ready right now.

 

My next question is how do you make a LT T56 bolt up to a LS engine?

 

What are the chances that the 5.3 will be allowed? LT1's from F bodies are getting damn hard to find. Iron 5.3's are everywhere and cheap.

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D Algozine

Stipulate a dimension from the firewall to the back of the cylinder head, that exactly matches the stock location of an LT1 in a 3rd gen. Same for the height from the top of the K member to the bottom edge of the block. A few quick measurements to provide compliance.

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nape1548534725
My next question is how do you make a LT T56 bolt up to a LS engine?

 

From what I understand, you'd need an LS T56 input shaft, LS bellhousing, LS clutch, and LS clutch hydraulics.

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Glenn
My next question is how do you make a LT T56 bolt up to a LS engine?

 

From what I understand, you'd need an LS T56 input shaft, LS bellhousing, LS clutch, and LS clutch hydraulics.

 

And a LS1 front plate for the trans case.

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Steve91T

So in other words, sell the LT tranny and find a LS tranny. Got it.

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Den341548534727

Also, contrary to popular belief the LT1 clutch pedal is not the same as the LS1. There is about a 1/8th inch difference in the location of the stud for the slave cylinder rod.......Ask me how i know

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wastntim
LS engines into LT cars isn't bad. You do have to use an LS K member though. Shouldn't be too hard to find though.

 

You do not need to use a LS K member. The stock third gen K member will work with some adapters for the mounts.

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wastntim

So far I have heard of five different third gen owners that are interested in this rule change.

 

Quite frankly, I think if this change does help the third gens at all, it should be given to them as they are at a disadvantage as far as the track width is concerned. I cannot get to the track widths specified in the rules due to the fact my fenders rub on the tires, even with the lips being rolled. Fourth Gens have wider fenders and, therefore, have an advantage over the third gens.

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Steve91T

Why not narrow the width for all cars then.

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Glenn
LS engines into LT cars isn't bad. You do have to use an LS K member though. Shouldn't be too hard to find though.

 

You do not need to use a LS K member. The stock third gen K member will work with some adapters for the mounts.

 

Re-read his comments you quoted.

 

An LS1 motor installed into an LT1 car will require the LS1 K member as well as a few other LS1 car specific parts.

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Glenn
Why not narrow the width for all cars then.

 

A 1" reduction on all cars does not affect all cars the same since 1" is a different percent of total track width from platform to platform.

 

You also can't narrow up a 4th gen enough to make it where a Fox doesn't have to flare fenders.

I have OEM 17x9 wheels and I only run a 1/4" spacer on each side in the front. Not sure what 17x9.5 wheels will do to my ability to run spacers.

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wastntim

An LS1 motor installed into an LT1 car will require the LS1 K member as well as a few other LS1 car specific parts.

 

Maybe someone can help me understand as from reading this article about installing a LS1 in a third gen, it seems like a stock K member will work, especially since we are not running A/C.

http://www.thirdgen.org/techboard/ltx-lsx/448105-ls1-into-third-gen.html

 

I quote:

"Seeing as the LS1 does not simply just bolt right in you need to make some decisions here about what to do. If you are planning on keeping A/C, the stock K member will need modifications such as these (see links below) or you can buy a tubular K member from Hawks or Spohn already made with LS1 mounts. The K member route is certainly a nice upgrade when you consider there is further weight savings and it allows a lot more room to work around the engine over stock but there is a pretty big cost involved. Modifying your stock K member is pretty easy if you have a welder and it’s also very cost effective. "

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Glenn

Your thinking 3rd gen. The comment was about 4th gens.

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wastntim

I guess my confusion was he LT1 cars and I have a third gen with an LT1.

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Steve91T

I sure hope the 5.3 will allowed. I'm not sure if my LT1 is hitting on all 8, and if it's not, I absolutely do not want to try to find another Fbody LT1 again. They are really hard to find.

 

When will the new rules be posted?

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BADVENM
I sure hope the 5.3 will allowed. I'm not sure if my LT1 is hitting on all 8, and if it's not, I absolutely do not want to try to find another Fbody LT1 again. They are really hard to find.

 

When will the new rules be posted?

 

Rule change requests can be submitted through Oct 16. Al hopes to have the 2014 rules out by the end of November.

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Steve91T

Perfect. Thanks.

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Glenn

Fixing what you have will cost much less than swapping.

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Dustin M.

This no tuning thing is a concern of mine. Is the implication that you run the 5.3 on the 5.7's tune? Or do you have to swap the entire 5.3 harness in with? Though difficult to police, it is possible to change nothing but the displacement within the tune. Also, I only see the LS4 as being prohibited. Is the intent only to allow the 5.3 with LS1 based heads? Because the newer ones have LS6 based heads.

Edited by Guest

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Glenn

Gotta use the 5.7 stuff.

Running a 5.7 tune will be fine.

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