Tianheng Posted May 28, 2021 Share Posted May 28, 2021 Hi all, I am recently try to apply for a NASA competition license (I currently have a SCCA License). And to be able fully submit my license application, I have to pass the CCR test online. However, I found the question and options that the online test gave is very vague and the more reading I did, the more confusing. In the end, I started to enumerate the answers and kept failing this test. My email inbox is full of test failure notifications now. My confusion usually comes from unclear problem statement or options. Question: What is considered blocking (per the NASA CCR)? Options: 2 consecutive line changes, 3 consecutive line changes The book says 2 is defined as blocking, but 3 is not? Question: During a race restart (not an aborted start) situation, do we resume racing in double file or single file order? The book says the race director has the right to decide how to make a restart. So I chose "sometimes one way, sometimes the other". I am not sure if this is the right answer. Question: You are racing with another car when there is an incident between two corner stations. The corner station before the incident is waiving a single yellow while the station after is not displaying a flag. When can you pass? By book, I think both "Before the first corner" and "until pass the incident or next manned flag station without yellow flag" are correct. CORRECT me if I am wrong here. Question: You had a close race where you were punted off track. You feel it might have been on purpose and you’re decidedly upset. Which actions do not violate the CCR: I think 3 answers here are correct: "file RFA", "Calm down and discuss with other drivers" and "both Calm down and discuss with other drivers and file RFA". I didn't see any rules prevent me talking to the other driver in a calm way. Please help me here, the test is not helping me understand the unique rules NASA has, but more like a English reading test (remind me of my SAT) Thank you!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camryn Reed Posted May 31, 2021 Share Posted May 31, 2021 Having the Same issue. I can not get past this CCR Test. I am confident in the answers but not sure if it is a system error or a trick question that is in there but frstrating. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
National Staff Aldrin V. Posted June 2, 2021 National Staff Share Posted June 2, 2021 On 5/27/2021 at 10:44 PM, Tianheng said: Question: What is considered blocking (per the NASA CCR)? Options: 2 consecutive line changes, 3 consecutive line changes The book says 2 is defined as blocking, but 3 is not? The correct answer would be 2 consecutive line changes as that what it states on the CCR. On 5/27/2021 at 10:44 PM, Tianheng said: Question: During a race restart (not an aborted start) situation, do we resume racing in double file or single file order? The book says the race director has the right to decide how to make a restart. So I chose "sometimes one way, sometimes the other". I am not sure if this is the right answer. The correct answer would be "Single File" Refer to CCR section 20.12 On 5/27/2021 at 10:44 PM, Tianheng said: Question: You are racing with another car when there is an incident between two corner stations. The corner station before the incident is waiving a single yellow while the station after is not displaying a flag. When can you pass? By book, I think both "Before the first corner" and "until pass the incident or next manned flag station without yellow flag" are correct. CORRECT me if I am wrong here. This is the correct answer - After the incident or until passed the next manned station not displaying a yellow flag, whichever comes first. On 5/27/2021 at 10:44 PM, Tianheng said: Question: You had a close race where you were punted off track. You feel it might have been on purpose and you’re decidedly upset. Which actions do not violate the CCR: I think 3 answers here are correct: "file RFA", "Calm down and discuss with other drivers" and "both Calm down and discuss with other drivers and file RFA". I didn't see any rules prevent me talking to the other driver in a calm way. We will be updating this question to reflect answers that are in line with the CCR 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tianheng Posted June 2, 2021 Author Share Posted June 2, 2021 Thanks for the clarification! To "The correct answer would be 2 consecutive line changes as that what it states on the CCR." I think a better way to resolve this question is to update the rule as "2 or more consecutive line changes is defined as blocking.", just to be more precise and avoid confusion in the future. To "Single file start", in 20.12.2, it also says race director has the right to choose the proper start format. Not trying to be a picky jerk here, but after the first time fail the test, I have to study the book to make sure I made the right choices, but it seems more confusion in that chapter. To "yellow flag", I actually very curious to know if "Before the first corner" is actually right movement in such circumstances? I was taught that finish the passing before the yellow flag is legal during one of my NASA HPDE3 download session. Thanks for the discussion!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
National Staff Aldrin V. Posted June 2, 2021 National Staff Share Posted June 2, 2021 Thanks for the feedback! We are always taking a look at better ways of improving the CCR test taking experience and definitely appreciate telling us your issues. We have revised to the test to make the questions more clear and that the answers are more in line with the latest version of the NASA CCR. If you have any other questions, please feel free to DM me! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeadChange41 Posted July 22, 2021 Share Posted July 22, 2021 I was having the same issue and found the trick question... its on the Blue/Yellow flag answers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug10 Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 I am also having LOTS of problems with the NASA test. Not only are the questions vague, but the CCR itself lacks specificity. The CCR does not do a good job of answering important questions in a definitive way. Seems like we should want as much clarity as possible in the CCR because that would help all racers. So, can you help me with the follow questions? 1. Your race group has two green flag starts to separate classes in the same group. The first group starts, but two cars have an incident disabling one on the outside of the track past turn 1. Your group is approaching the starter where you expect to get the green flag and instead you see a Green and Yellow flag. Is this a valid start for your race? Reading section 19.3.18 (which is specific to Green and Yellow flags waving), it does not state whether or not this indicates a valid start. Seems like a trick question to me, but I certainly want to know what the answer is! 2. Your car becomes disabled and you need to pull off the track, but you can't make it back to the pits. Can you get out of the car? Again, this seems like a trick question. The question does not state why the car was "disabled." Section 25.9 of CCR says that stopping is prohibited unless in an "emergency" which is further defined as "medical problems, mechanical failure or on-board fire." Section 25.10 says that in the event of a crash, "the driver may exit the vehicle if it is safe to do so." Sooo...if the reason for the car being disabled is a mechanical failure, then per Section 25.9 it would be OK to exit the vehicle. Or so it would seem. Further, CCR section 25.9 states that it is acceptable to exit the car if involved in a "major crash or rollover." Again, this is very confusing and the question could be interpreted in MANY different ways, leading to a variety of correct answers. Sheez! 3. You are not satisfied with the outcome of an appeal made to the Race Director. You've decided to make an Executive Appeal. You should do which of the following first? Again, CCR lacks specifics regarding this situation. Section 17.5.3 does NOT state an order of importance. Additionally, Section 17.5.3 does not state, specifically, what should be done first. Again, this seems to be written to trip people up. Why do that?? 4. What happens if you have contact with another car? What do you do? The pre-defined answers to this question do NOT line up with what is stated in Section 27.4.1, which states, "Any driver involved in body contact must go directly to impound and fill out a contact report form." The answer that is closest to what is stated ALSO includes verbiage about taking the contact report form "and turn it in to the race director." However, because this phrase was not included in the answer, it seems as though it is incorrect. Therefore, several of the answers could be right...or wrong. Confusing as heck. Bottom line is that I want to get a NASA competition license. But it seems as though the CCR authors and the test creators just want to have fun tripping us up. We're all adults here, why not treat us as such? Surely the primary motivations for creating the CCR and the test are to ensure that we all understand the rules. So, if we all understand, then we can all abide by them, making NASA competition events fun. Instead, this just feels like someone trying to screw with us. Very frustrating. Can anyone help with these questions? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weston Walter Posted September 15, 2021 Share Posted September 15, 2021 I'm having the same issues and put in a support request two days ago. I'm to the point now where I'm changing answers I know are correct, just to see if they were a 'trick question'. Is there a way to email the licensing director and copy/paste the sections from the CCR that correspond with the question to show you have reviewed and know the material? There's questions like the one being in a disabled car and should you exit the car. Well, there is no info in the question or option of if the car is on fire or not. There seem to be a few questions like that and I can't pass the test despite reviewing the CCR over a dozen times. Thanks in advance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edphx Posted October 26, 2021 Share Posted October 26, 2021 I'm in the same boat. Some of these scenarios are not addressed in the CC&Rs at all, and other questions have multiple correct answers. During a race restart (not an aborted start) situation, do we resume racing in double file or single file order? Double File Single file Sometimes one way, sometimes the other 20.12 states "Restarts are single file, unless otherwise mandated," but "Sometimes one way, sometimes the other" doesn't seem correct. I suspect they are looking for "single file," but that is not what the 20.12 says. If you see all stations on course display a black flag, why might that happen? Parts fell off my car The session has been stopped They are warning a bad driver They are warning me of a bad driver The problem with this question (aside from the grammar) is the answer should be "session has been stopped," but the global black flag for stopping a session is "waved," not "displayed." A displayed black flag could be a personal command to driver to report to the black flag station, which if ignored, could be "displayed" at every flag station. You learn of an issue with your competitor’s vehicle that could get him or her disqualified. What is your obligation? Notify the race director or the competitor immediately. Notify the race director or the competitor after the race. Say nothing as pointing this out is unsportsmanlike. Immediately disclose that information to that competitor, entrant, or team, or to the Race Director The answer is probably "Say nothing" based on a loose interpretation of 23.1.2., which includes under unsportsmanlike conduct, "willfully using non-performance technicalities to hurt another competitor’s race," but the question does not provide any details on the "issue." Are the numbers 1/4" too short? Is the roll cage fabricated with .00003" copper tubing? This wouldn't be a big deal if the incorrect answeres were disclosed. We could at least then confirm that the crappy questions we managed to guess right were in fact correct, and focus on the rest. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ale Sensoli Posted October 30, 2021 Share Posted October 30, 2021 same issues here. I CANT PASS THE TEST because the tricky questions. I don't really understand why we need tricky questions. tricky questions bring to tentatives of interpretation. While I think we should have CLEAR RULES TO FOLLOW that are the same always and any cases. not depending of the understanding of the tricky questions Your race group has two green flag starts to separate classes in the same group. The first group starts, but two cars have an incident disabling one on the outside of the track past turn 1. Your group is approaching the starter where you expect to get the green flag and instead you see a Green and Yellow flag. Is this a valid start for your race? Uses: During a start/restart, if there is an incident requiring a waving yellow from the starter’s stand, drivers may encounter this combination of flags. In a case requiring this combination of flags, all passes must be completed before the starter’s stand. In the case where vehicles are side by side (any overlap) from the double file start the vehicle with the higher numbered grid spot will yield to the vehicle with the lower numbered grid spot in order to move past the incident in single file. SO IS YES OR NO? What do you do in this situation? The pace car exits the pits in front of you with lights on and waives you by. 19.4.1 Passing the Pace Car is not permitted unless motioned to do so from the personnel in the Pace Car. waives you by = MOTIONED TO DO SO? Your car becomes disabled and you need to pull off track, but you can’t make it back to the pits. Can you get out of the car? 25.9.1 Stopping in an Emergency Anytime a driver is forced to stop in an emergency; the first concern should be to place the car in an area where it will not cause danger to the other drivers. When stopping off course, the driver should be careful not to stop on dry grass areas where fire can be a hazard. The crew may come to the aid of a disabled car only with the approval of the Race Director. The driver may make repairs if the vehicle is in a safe area, such as behind a wall or flag stand. so is yes no or the longer answer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billy bee Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 (edited) This was initially posted almost a year ago and I am having the same issues. What does it take to pass this friggin' test? Is not passing the test part of the test. NASA just wants to see if we keep trying. Racing requires persistence, right? --bb Edited April 13, 2022 by billy bee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VNGracing Posted May 11, 2022 Share Posted May 11, 2022 I guess everyone has the same question about this test and there's no "standard correct" answer. They request 100% correct in order to get the license. Problem is you do not know what's correct and what's incorrect. How do we correct the incorrect if we do not know what's right or wrong? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Heitman Posted August 30, 2022 Share Posted August 30, 2022 I have given up on this test. I'm very persistent, but after 30 tries and countless reads of CCR, I don't think it's going to happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Heitman Posted August 31, 2022 Share Posted August 31, 2022 Update. NASA staff has helped resolved this issue. Thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slyez Posted November 22, 2022 Share Posted November 22, 2022 Can you let us know how they helped? Did they explain something that allowed you to get the correct answers from the CCRs, or is there some other way to resolve this? Stuck on the test, and about to throw in the towel and just race with another local club that doesn't have the test requirements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Wadas Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 I am with you. I sat with Tage Saturday and went thru this and everybody passed the test without CCR's? I have not been able to pass and you don't know which one you missed.......SCCA and the other local in Az requires non of this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian54 Posted April 5, 2023 Share Posted April 5, 2023 Bloody hell! This test is as dumb as it gets. Can someone please tell me what I am answering wrong? Pace car waves you by? c)pass and catch up to the group Green and yellow flag is a valid start? a) Yes During restart order? b) Single file Pole sitter in a race? b) whichever side is inside of turn 1 Passing car has "right of line"? a) when front wheel is next to driver Number of races to clear "rookie status'? d) 8 What is considered a blocking move? c) 2 line changes Is there a time you can drive counter race? d) for a short distance, in an extreme emergency of when told by an official All stations display black flag? b) the session has been stopped Contact with another car? c) report to impound and fill out contact report Motionless yellow and red flag? d) the start has been aborted Learn of a competitors issue with their vehicle? d) immediately tell the competitor, entrant, team or official Time to escape during emergency? c) 15 secs You were punted off track what should you do? b) let off steam in your trailer and calmly discuss Blue flag with yellow stripe? b) faster vehicle approaching Incident between two flag stands? d) after incident passed or next station not displaying Your car becomes disabled? d) only if stopped behind a wall, flag stand or an emergency event Not satisficed with the outcome? b) inform race director you wish to appeal to executive director Racing room? d) 3/4 car width If someone could help. I've been a race driver for 12 years and over 200 races but I can't figure out where I went wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
National Staff Brett B. Posted April 5, 2023 National Staff Share Posted April 5, 2023 20.3.2 Choosing the pole The pole sitter side will by default, always go to the inside of the first turn, unless otherwise mandated or approved by the Race Director. If the pole sitter is allowed to choose the opposite side, that will only "reverse" the first row and have no effect on drivers that are 3rd or higher on the grid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian54 Posted April 5, 2023 Share Posted April 5, 2023 4 hours ago, Brett B. said: 20.3.2 Choosing the pole The pole sitter side will by default, always go to the inside of the first turn, unless otherwise mandated or approved by the Race Director. If the pole sitter is allowed to choose the opposite side, that will only "reverse" the first row and have no effect on drivers that are 3rd or higher on the grid. Is that the only one I have wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian54 Posted April 5, 2023 Share Posted April 5, 2023 I must have something else wrong because that didn't do it! Pulling my (%*% hair out!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
National Staff Brett B. Posted April 5, 2023 National Staff Share Posted April 5, 2023 25.8 Counter-Course Driving Participants shall not drive on the course in the direction opposite to the normal traffic flow, unless a driver must do so for a short distance, in an extreme emergency and only for the sole purposes of getting out of harm’s way, or when ordered to do so by a Course Officia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
National Staff Brett B. Posted April 5, 2023 National Staff Share Posted April 5, 2023 Your car becomes disabled? d) only if stopped behind a wall, flag stand or an emergency event. This one might be no, unless it's on fire or involved in a serious crash, such as a rollover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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