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Nationals only 1 timed session or mutliple sessions??


Red Tornado
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Was curious so could plan tires,etc..

 

Also if more than 1 session will it be over more than 1 day??

 

If only 1 session it would mean a real need to get some real clear track.

 

Wonder when will the schedule for the whole week be finalized. I see those early M-O practice days that I assume we can sign up for also.

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  • National Staff
Was curious so could plan tires,etc..

 

Also if more than 1 session will it be over more than 1 day??

 

If only 1 session it would mean a real need to get some real clear track.

 

Wonder when will the schedule for the whole week be finalized. I see those early M-O practice days that I assume we can sign up for also.

 

The current plan is for three days of typical TT competition sessions, with the best time of the three days counting for the Championship. This could change, though.

 

We should be good to go on the Wednesday test and practice session for those that choose to sign up for it. If you call the school, you can find out about the Monday and Tuesday school days.

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What about adding your best time from each day???

 

Equalizes rain problems, and puts an emphasis on a getting good time that 1st day.

 

 

oh and general timing practice, what having the 1st session of the day always count. I see in th TT rules that the 1st session won't always timed. Practice is over rated anyways.

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What about adding your best time from each day???

 

Equalizes rain problems, and puts an emphasis on a getting good time that 1st day.

 

 

oh and general timing practice, what having the 1st session of the day always count. I see in th TT rules that the 1st session won't always timed. Practice is over rated anyways.

Allen, I think that having your best time over three days as your competition time is the best rain equalizer, because everyone is bound to get some dry sessions that way. Also, it helps to equalize the "home field advantage" that the local drivers have. Most likely I will stick with the first session of each day not counting. However, if there is a good reason to allow the first session of the second or third day to count, then I may allow it--an example would be that we had a wet first day, the track is going to be dry for the first session on the second day, and the forecast is for rain to come back a few hours later. I don't want this to be a competition between only the AWD's.

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In support of Greg's point, we had a really messy weekend at Cal Speedway this past weekend. Rain, hail, and sleet on and off, and an infield that got pretty seriously flooded.

 

I got a decent time in the warm up on Saturday, but that session doesn't count. I didn't get a time in the second session, and the flooded infield was trecherous for the third and fourth sessions. I raged in the third session, but no matter how well I drove, the times would be nowhere near a guy who got a timed lap in the second session.

 

The same thing almost happened on Sunday. I did a semi-decent lap in the first session, which didn't count, and then bent a wheel and got a flat in the second session. It happened early on and I didn't get a time. Then it started raining lightly. Now if water accumulated on the track, there was no way even if I finished ahead of every class car AND every car all the way through TTR, that I'd be able to put down a time to match even a bad dry lap time. Luckily the track grip remained, but the point is that Greg's plan will equalize all of this and give people plenty of chances.

 

This is also important for guys planning to travel 5,000 miles round trip. If they have mechanical issues that take a full day to deal with and you have a system where you add up each day's fastest times, there's no way they'll be competitive. This certainly makes no logical sense.

 

I think best lap over three days, winner take all, encourages some good restlessness and competition. You may spank a guy the first day, but that's no guarantee that you'll win if he elevates his game. It put pressure on you to keep stepping up.

 

I'm with Greg.

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So did I hear right...3 sessions a day for 3 days at the nationals so perhaps as much as 3-5 hours of track time besides wed. practice day.

 

That's much better than I thought considering they have races, etc.. I guess the advantage of no HPDE's.

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I really like the idea of using multiple lap times. There is nothing worse than getting beat by someone getting in a "hero" lap and beating you while you were whittling done your time. It takes more skill to be consistent. If your worried about weather it could be multiple laps in the same session.

 

I don't think that there will be much of a home field advantage. Everyone I've talked to from the West Coast thinks they'll be able to learn the track and have a good setup in 1 to 1 1/2 days.

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I really like the idea of using multiple lap times. There is nothing worse than getting beat by someone getting in a "hero" lap and beating you while you were whittling done your time. It takes more skill to be consistent. If your worried about weather it could be multiple laps in the same session.

 

I don't think that there will be much of a home field advantage. Everyone I've talked to from the West Coast thinks they'll be able to learn the track and have a good setup in 1 to 1 1/2 days.

 

The multiple lap time idea worked well for the Open Track Challenge, One Lap, and some other timed competitions, but this is Time Trial. Why should the format change for one event? The times I've been beat at the track, the driver who beat me was consistently faster... it wasn't a fluke. You're also going to find guys running around with just a splash of gas, sticker tires, taped up grilles, etc... it's the nature of the beast.

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I think best lap over three days, winner take all, encourages some good restlessness and competition. You may spank a guy the first day, but that's no guarantee that you'll win if he elevates his game. It put pressure on you to keep stepping up.

 

I understand the constant competition and restlessness throughout the week, but pushing people to step it up may cause people to go to far. We don't want a bunch of smashed up cars because people went for broke on 1 lap to get the TT title. Someone could get hurt, we could loose track time, and worse - look like the SCCA!

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I understand the constant competition and restlessness throughout the week, but pushing people to step it up...

 

But that's the nature of Time Trials, anyway. Going for broke happens as part of the adventure. Dial it back to where you're comfortable, in the meantime there will be kamikaze runs during the 3-day event.

 

I'd vote for the best time during the whole 3-day event as the time to count for the championship. Suppose someone turns a flawless lap on day 1 and terminally breaks on day 2 and is done and on the trailer. The fact he/she isn't running on the last day shouldn't have any bearing on the fastest time of the event, IMHO.

 

Greg, I don't understand why the 1st session's time doesn't count for the event championship, why is that? I turned some good times at Road Atlanta during the 1st session, but to no avail.

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Greg, I don't understand why the 1st session's time doesn't count for the event championship, why is that? I turned some good times at Road Atlanta during the 1st session, but to no avail.

Jody, it's a safety issue. We want our TT drivers to go out in the first session and WARM-UP not go straight out and try to compete without learning 1) the track conditions for the day--any unexpected changes, 2) how their car is running that day, 3) how they are "running" that day. This just follows the same process as NASA racers use with a warm-up, then qualifying and racing. It has proven to be the most important on the 1st day of competition to help decrease the number of minor incidents (4-offs and spins). There are times in my Region when I allow the first session of the second day to count if there is a good reason: i.e. the weather is expected to turn sour quickly before the second session (usually extreme heat for us in the summer at Willow Springs), and our drivers did an exceptional job on the first competition day, giving me no reason to think that they can't go straight out the second day, do a few warm-up laps, and then go for it.

 

Whether or not I allow any of the first sessions to count at Mid-Ohio will be decided at the event, and will be based on the same criteria I use here at home. I will have a higher threshold to allow the first session to count at Mid-Ohio, but I won't rule it out at this time (for the second and third competition days).

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That makes sense now that you've explained it.

 

Do we know what days the TT will be at Mid-Ohio?

 

We don't have a schedule yet. Most likely, there will be two TT groups (faster and slower--sorry "slow" guys ), and they will each have three days (Th,Fri,Sat or Fri,Sat,Sun). But, that is from some very preliminary info I had months ago. This could certainly change very easily as the final scheduling is done. Wednesday is a test day for everyone. And, Monday and Tuesday the Mid-Ohio Driving School is holding classes where those that desire can also get more track time and instruction/tips from the locals.

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So 3 sessions a day for each of those 3 days or 9 total 25 minute sessions.

 

That seems like a nice amount of track time especially for those of us who will add Monday, Tuesday, and Wed possibly.

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Possibly 3 25-minute sessions--maybe 4 20-minutes sessions. It's all still unknown. But, with Wednesday's test day, and probably 3 competition days, we should all have plenty of time to learn the track.

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Doggone, with that much track time, I'm going to have to bring enough spare parts to fill what little precious trailer space I have. That's at least 2 sets of rotors, 2 set of pads, an extra set of tires and wheels. That's in additon to all the other stuff I normally bring along.

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Yup. But near last event of season so a go for broke attempt...might as well.

Besides all the vette guys can partner up and do a quick pit brake change. All of us will be doing at least 1 minimal you figure.

 

So Greg sounds like just 1 lap is all you need.

 

I did like OTC with 3 best laps and total time wins. Eliminates some random junk. Over 3 days and all those session 3 laps shouldn't be an issue.

 

Just my $.02

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For now, it's one lap. This can change, but I'm going to wait and see exactly what the schedule is, and how much run time we have. Whatever happens, I want this to be a contest of driving ability on a dry track. So, it may stay "one lap" to try to ensure that it is.

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For now, it's one lap. This can change, but I'm going to wait and see exactly what the schedule is, and how much run time we have. Whatever happens, I want this to be a contest of driving ability on a dry track. So, it may stay "one lap" to try to ensure that it is.

 

This is the only way to ensure each person gets his fastest lap on dry pavement with a working car without terrible traffic after having learned the track on any of the three days. Any other plan won't allow for this. If any of you are concerned with "ringer" laps, then TT isn't the place for you. Consistency is a great thing to strive for, but that's not what TT is about.

 

Throw on your gloves, get in the ring, and the winner takes home the belt...until the next meeting of course, when all is up for grabs again.

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For now, it's one lap. This can change, but I'm going to wait and see exactly what the schedule is, and how much run time we have. Whatever happens, I want this to be a contest of driving ability on a dry track. So, it may stay "one lap" to try to ensure that it is.

 

 

 

Im good with this.

My plan, run a good hard lap on day 1. This gives me a full day to fix ANYTHING that breaks. Ill have everything except another chassis. Then go for broke (no pun) on day 3 if need be.

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I thought that TT was the bridge between HPDE and wheel to wheel racing. A stepping stone into the higher racing series.

 

 

TT is where you go when you dont quite have the funds to go wheel to wheel racing.

 

or, you just need to learn a partictular track.

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