LMan Posted April 26, 2006 Share Posted April 26, 2006 Would a, say, 1974 Mercury Capri be legal for AI? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Matt Posted April 26, 2006 Share Posted April 26, 2006 Depends on how you define "American-made" sedan. Also, what's the stock wheelbase? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racercosmo Posted April 26, 2006 Share Posted April 26, 2006 JWL has told me numerous times no. I haven't measured the wheelbase, but it may also be under 100". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWL Posted April 26, 2006 Share Posted April 26, 2006 This is an intereting philsophical question and one we have hashed out before when someone astutely pointed out that some members of the Bowtie Brigade were in fact Quebecois and some other fellows wanted to show up with a V8 Merkur. The Thunder from Down Under GTO also raises some questions as to "American-made" and this is something we need to clarify for 2007. So, any "mushrooms and blotter tab" thoughts on whether we should switch this to "sold by a USDM manufacturer" or some such verbiage? This would let in Capris, Merkurs, and perhaps others that meet the technical requirements, but again I don't think we'd seen an arseload of them. -JWL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Matt Posted April 26, 2006 Share Posted April 26, 2006 Philosophically, I don't see a distinction between the German-designed and built, Mercury-badged early Capri and the Australian-designed and built, Pontiac-badged GTO (Monaro). I would have to say both or neither based on the definition of an "American" sedan. But wheelbase could still be a deal-breaker on the Capri. The GM F-body situation is just a quirk created by GM happening to transfer production to a Canadian plant. DaimlerChrysler 300s, Magnums and 300s are built in Canada too. The Merkur seems like a stretch, as that is not a domestic nameplate. With production as international as it is these days, it's tough to establish national origin without tracing the money back to its home turf. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff F Posted April 26, 2006 Share Posted April 26, 2006 Wheelbase of a 1974 Mercury Capri is 100.75". Is it a coupe or a sedan? The introduction to our ruleset of states that "This class is designed to field a large high-profile group of American Musclecars...", and eligible vehicles are "All 1960 through present, American-made sedan vehicles..." Ignoring the technicalities, I don't see where a '74 Capri or Merkur fits into the intent. While the F-bodies and GTO aren't "American-made", I would certainly consider them "American Musclecars" Perhaps our rules should state that the vehicle had to be available with a V8 engine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pederb Posted April 26, 2006 Share Posted April 26, 2006 I have always been under the impression that American Iron is for Muscle Cars, and a 74 Capri would not fall under that category but an Australian made GTO with V8 would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Matt Posted April 26, 2006 Share Posted April 26, 2006 There's a lot of competing verbiage going on. Can anyone define "musclecar?" I won't even try, but I don't consider late-model Thunderchickens to be musclecars even thought they came with V-8s. I also don't consider the whale-bodied cop-car Caprices to be musclecars, but they are also domestic, V-8 powered, rear-wheel drive sedans. How about a 78 King Cobra? I think a V-8 Capri is as legit as any of those, and probably has a better road racing pedigree too. And since V-6s are legal in the class, why would V-8 power be a decisive criteria? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racercosmo Posted April 26, 2006 Share Posted April 26, 2006 I remember the comments about the intent of the series in itself excludes the Capri. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ST#97 Posted May 5, 2006 Share Posted May 5, 2006 I kind of like the idea of an XR4ti at about 2200 lbs wet with 4 wheel independant suspension and 275/40's all around! Car would be insanely fast with hardly any power at all.... Might start cruising the local Autotrader where we can pick these things up for a grand or less!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LMan Posted May 8, 2006 Author Share Posted May 8, 2006 mmmmkay....so where would one race, say, a '74 Capri in NASA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat L. Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 Performance Touring... see the "PT" forum, Greg Greenbaum is the director. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white_2kgt Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 mmmmkay....so where would one race, say, a '74 Capri in NASA? you should start a SPEC Capri class Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanElam Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 Philosophically, I don't see a distinction between the German-designed and built, Mercury-badged early Capri ....... The Merkur seems like a stretch, as that is not a domestic nameplate. The Merkur was a Mercury (domestic) nameplate. I actually had thought about looking at Merkur to run as AI, but never researched the specifics. Moreover, section 6.1 of your rules specifically mentions the Capri so that would seem rather unambiguous that the cars are allowed. My guess is that the 'domestic' issue is going to be a problem as the fields get bigger and people look for a competitive edge. My $0.02 would be to follow the lead of other sanctioning bodies and just go ahead and make a list of the specific cars allowed. It could save a lot of headaches later. Canada, for example, builds the current Lincoln. Dodge builds the Charger in Ontario. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Corkran Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 Merkur is specifically mentioned as a German manufacturer for GTS class. The German Capri isn't mentioned there either, but since it was designed and built by Ford of Germany, it should be legal for GTS - assuming it wasn't sold in the US only? The Capri specifically mentioned in the AI rules is the '79+ Fox body Mustang clone. Edit: Word I got from GTS Coordinator is that German-built Capris are legal in GTS, though some early '70s cars were built in UK plants and therefore are not legal for GTS (?). Don't know if any of those cars were imported to the US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LMan Posted May 10, 2006 Author Share Posted May 10, 2006 mmmmkay....so where would one race, say, a '74 Capri in NASA? you should start a SPEC Capri class I would if there was any profit in it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PDenbigh Posted May 10, 2006 Share Posted May 10, 2006 So, is a Merkur XR4ti legal for both GTS and AI then? (Not a random question, I drive my XR with NASA MA) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white_2kgt Posted May 10, 2006 Share Posted May 10, 2006 So, is a Merkur XR4ti legal for both GTS and AI then? (Not a random question, I drive my XR with NASA MA) That would be fun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidney Posted May 10, 2006 Share Posted May 10, 2006 Sure...a Pantera is also eligible (also sold through Lincoln-Mercury dealers, has a Ford 351, and is rear-wheel drive). That's closer to American Iron than a German made, German Branded, German Engined Merkur! Have a nice day, Sidney Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pederb Posted May 10, 2006 Share Posted May 10, 2006 So, is a Merkur XR4ti legal for both GTS and AI then? (Not a random question, I drive my XR with NASA MA) NO it's still not legal for American Iron and never will be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pederb Posted May 10, 2006 Share Posted May 10, 2006 Sure...a Pantera is also eligible (also sold through Lincoln-Mercury dealers, has a Ford 351, and is rear-wheel drive). That's closer to American Iron than a German made, German Branded, German Engined Merkur! Have a nice day, Sidney NOT for American Iron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff F Posted May 10, 2006 Share Posted May 10, 2006 Sure...a Pantera is also eligible (also sold through Lincoln-Mercury dealers, has a Ford 351, and is rear-wheel drive). A Pantera is not front engined, nor is it a solid axle or "approved IRS" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PDenbigh Posted May 11, 2006 Share Posted May 11, 2006 So, is a Merkur XR4ti legal for both GTS and AI then? (Not a random question, I drive my XR with NASA MA) NO it's still not legal for American Iron and never will be. Woah, easy buddy, just asking. Must have struck a nerve! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidney Posted May 15, 2006 Share Posted May 15, 2006 I guess I need to start using the "smiley faces" after my smart a.. comments as I was trying to be funny with the Pantera remark! Sidney AI #64 1989 Pontiac Firebird (made in California, USA) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pederb Posted May 15, 2006 Share Posted May 15, 2006 Sorry guys, but you have no idea how many emails and calls we are getting about this. Can I run a Vette in AI, can I run X? and on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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