TexaST-1 Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 I have raced with the SCCA for 10 years, NASA for five and have had a couple years of DE experience prior to that. I thought I might make a post for drivers looking to spend money on their cars for either faster lap times and safety upgrades. 1. Racing "Type" Seat and 5 point harness. This will allow you as "The Driver" to do your job vs attempting to hold yourself in the driver's compartment around the track. This should be the best seat you can afford depending on your use for this car ie. daily driver or DE build-up or weekend warrior. A full blown competition seat, while offering the best performance may hinder your egression in and out on a daily basis. They are also the strongest and most light weight. You may want to opt for an adjustable more daily user friendly type of seat. The 5 point harness needs to be mounted properly or it can become more dangerous than a stock shoulder/lap belt. Please use the instructions while mounting. 2. Brake Pads and Fluid. Why brake pads instead of tires because of safety and performance. You need to slow your car quickly and effectively. Stock brake pads and brake fluid were not designed for HPDE. Racing pads and fluid will help maintain pedal pressure and pad wear. The investment will payoff in better performance and longevity of the pads and braking system. Braided Stainless Lines are also a good investment to replace the stock rubber ones that will start to give after some time and heat are applied. Some may see brake upgrades as more important than the racing seat and I can agree with that to a point. I'll debate back and forth to a point. There are pros and cons for each. I will lean towards driver care. How can you find the brake pedal while being forced to the passenger side of the car? 3. Tires. This will also, depending on what type of car you have, create the need for further upgrades. Accusmps, wheel bearings, shocks and other refinements to aid with the new found grip! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbgeek Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 1. Racing "Type" Seat and 5 point harness. 2. Brake Pads and Fluid. 3. Tires. As a HPDE 3 student, I completely agree with your points, but would conditionally argue the brakes vs seat. The seats in my car have exceptional bolstering and keep me and my instructor in place really well... until you introduce tires. Lesser seats, ie mustang et al, will not hold you at all, and in those cases, I would argue seats Once you buy some decent tires, whether good streets, DOT Rs, or Rs, ANY stock seat without a harness is inadequate, leaving you to brace yourself with your arms and legs. Shouldn't arms and legs be used for controlling the vehicle? Absolutely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexaST-1 Posted August 10, 2006 Author Share Posted August 10, 2006 You are correct. I forget that more new sporty cars have better seats than before. However, I would say they are few. Your car seat would not be the normal for what I see as a "Majority" in seats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subachad Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Those are good points, but as stated, the starting point will vary your mods completely. For example, an STI comes with good seats, great brakes and great tires. An Rx8 on the other hand has wonderful seats, good brakes (upgrad pads and fluid for sure) some ok tires which are good for learning but not great for going fast and a lot of body roll. If you start with a Civic, you need everything... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexaST-1 Posted August 10, 2006 Author Share Posted August 10, 2006 A friend of mine races a Mazda RX-8 in SCCA T3. The gift of grip has given him extreme fuel starvation in the truns, by slammin all of his fuel to one side of the tank. He can only run so many laps even with a full tank before it starts. I used to have that problem with a C4 Corvette when I first started DE'ing going onto the high bank at TWS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 you do need to note that r-compounds tend to have less predictable breakaway characteristics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexaST-1 Posted August 10, 2006 Author Share Posted August 10, 2006 you do need to note that r-compounds tend to have less predictable breakaway characteristics Absolutely. That is why I have been a Goodyear Tire contract driver for 6 years. I know what to expect, gives me an edge late in the race. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nonsense Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 1. Racing "Type" Seat and 5 point harness. This will allow you as "The Driver" to do your job vs attempting to hold yourself in the driver's compartment around the track. I personally wouldn't wear a harness w/o rollover protection. So I would say Brakes first, then tires, then seat, then rollbar and 5-point. I drive a Civic with upgraded brake pads, sticky street tires (Azenis), upgraded suspension and stock seats. The seats are the next weak link to take care of for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Twanksta Posted September 23, 2006 Share Posted September 23, 2006 1. Racing "Type" Seat and 5 point harness. This will allow you as "The Driver" to do your job vs attempting to hold yourself in the driver's compartment around the track. I personally wouldn't wear a harness w/o rollover protection. So I would say Brakes first, then tires, then seat, then rollbar and 5-point. I drive a Civic with upgraded brake pads, sticky street tires (Azenis), upgraded suspension and stock seats. The seats are the next weak link to take care of for me. +1, Im at the exact same point. Ive got uprgraded Integra brakes w/ powerslot rotors/hawk pads and motul rbf600 fluid, falken azenis, and some suspension work, STOCK seat, and BOY DO I HAVE TO HANG ON FOR MY LIFE! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FBI AGENT Posted September 24, 2006 Share Posted September 24, 2006 I have an 89 mustang coupe that was converted from a 4 cyl. The first thing I changed was the brakes. Next was the suspension (Maxium Motorsports is great). Then the tires and rims were updated. I am looking for a seat now. I would have went with the seat earlier but it has a rollcage w/5pt harness. My driving exp now mandates that I get a seat. I need a BIGGER seat as the normal seats are to small. Any suggestions would be great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nasaregistrar Posted September 24, 2006 Share Posted September 24, 2006 I have an 89 mustang coupe that was converted from a 4 cyl. The first thing I changed was the brakes. Next was the suspension (Maxium Motorsports is great). Then the tires and rims were updated. I am looking for a seat now. I would have went with the seat earlier but it has a rollcage w/5pt harness. My driving exp now mandates that I get a seat. I need a BIGGER seat as the normal seats are to small. Any suggestions would be great. Sparco Evo2 is a big guy seat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerkat Posted September 24, 2006 Share Posted September 24, 2006 I drive a '03 Mustang/Cobra vert. I am a big guy, in the stomach anyway, I put the OMP Big Seat in and like it a lot. The only problem I had was that I could not physical put two Big seat in the car. My passenger's seat is a standard width OMP seat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FBI AGENT Posted September 24, 2006 Share Posted September 24, 2006 Beerkat are you going to roebling next weekend? If so I would like to take a look at it. I am not sure if I have met you or not. I went to cmp with the svt club in the spring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexaST-1 Posted September 25, 2006 Author Share Posted September 25, 2006 I have run a MOMO Top NASCAR since 1999. It considered an "American" style seat with a little more hip room. The faster you go the more you will appreciate your seat! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FBI AGENT Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Thanks for the info on the seats. Hopefully I will have one soon! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ev Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 I am with the others here brakes first... A 5 point belt without rollover protection or 4 point belt = dumb.... Is anyone using a CG lock? I am curious on how well they work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexaST-1 Posted September 27, 2006 Author Share Posted September 27, 2006 Great on the brakes. I guess it depends on how well your car is equiped from the factory. I would think a good set of PFC 01 or Hawks is a great idea plus racing brake fluid. Since I am kinda of new to this please explain to me and others how having a 5 point safty harness and a racing seat is dangerous without rollover protection. I guess I just don't see how being thrown around inside a car with a simple lap belt and single should restraint = smart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Twanksta Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Great on the brakes. I guess it depends on how well your car is equiped from the factory. I would think a good set of PFC 01 or Hawks is a great idea plus racing brake fluid. Since I am kinda of new to this please explain to me and others how having a 5 point safty harness and a racing seat is dangerous without rollover protection. I guess I just don't see how being thrown around inside a car with a simple lap belt and single should restraint = smart Have fun being stuck straight up as your roof crinkles down on top of you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexaST-1 Posted September 27, 2006 Author Share Posted September 27, 2006 Wow stuck straight up when the roof crinkles. What happens when the stock seat belt snap locks and holds you in place or would it stay completely slack? That is completely different. You must be talking about being dropped on your roof not rolling. Maybe we are talking about a convertible, which isn't even legal for NASA HPDE. Like I said before, I am just geting started and am wondering how often cars roll over in your DEs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Twanksta Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Its not just for the DE's. If you had a racing seat and harness' and drive your car on the street(which most people in DE's are) then you will be most likely always wearing your harness. It is very likely that you can flip on the streets. Also the stock seat belt, not sure about this, but in that sitution will let you slide or fall under where you would not be crushed(of course not in all cases but you get the point.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexaST-1 Posted September 27, 2006 Author Share Posted September 27, 2006 Yes, I do get your point and sometimes I forget these cars are driven on the street. The stock belt could also let you slide up or down in that rollover. I have seen several cars roll or flip, aside from Joey Hand at Mid-Ohio, the damage is relatively lighter than one might expect. I have seen several push the roof out, replace the front windshield and return for the next race. I still not sure that being held sucurely inplace durring a track session or a street crah is a bad thing. I guess each wreck would be different. Some of the wrecks I have seen in DE are either so light they a more of an insult and some are so sever nothing would have changed the outcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Twanksta Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Dont get me wrong, having a nice seat and harness for the track session would be awesome! You just never know whats in store for you, so if you dont have a cage you are taking a risk even though the chances are slim you will turn over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ev Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Its not just for the DE's. If you had a racing seat and harness' and drive your car on the street(which most people in DE's are) then you will be most likely always wearing your harness. It is very likely that you can flip on the streets. Also the stock seat belt, not sure about this, but in that sitution will let you slide or fall under where you would not be crushed(of course not in all cases but you get the point.) More or less what he said. In a roll over, the stock 3 point will allow you to rotate away and/or the seat back could break and allow you to move with a roof that is crushing down on you. Not so much with the seat, but for sure with a 5 point harness, you will become the roll bar.... not a pretty thought huh? The 4 point issue is you may submarine, sliding under the lap belt which may cause you to be disemboweled. This doesn’t happen as often with a 3 point because you usually bend forward much further than when restrained by a 4 point system. I have read a lot of research on this and firmly agree, either stay with a stock belt system, or go the whole way. With that being said, I am still undecided on going with a better seat though. That may be one area you can get away with and still be okay. The jury is still out on that one for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nasaregistrar Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 I am with the others here brakes first... A 5 point belt without rollover protection or 4 point belt = dumb.... Is anyone using a CG lock? I am curious on how well they work. Bill, James the timing guy got one and has used it but I don't know how he liked it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexaST-1 Posted September 27, 2006 Author Share Posted September 27, 2006 Ev, You are very correct on a 4 point, in fact the NASA rules make a 4 point illegal because it is more dangerous because of the "Submarine Effect." I, at no point, recommended a 4 point. A quality race seat and a 5 point harness. I, again, can see your point but your point is made by disregarding any factory roll-over protection and as if the car was being dropped on it's roof not rolled over. I can't imagine running at full speed, which is the only way I will discuss, not having a racing seat and FIVE point harness. Some stock seats are better than others, but you as the driver need to be able to do your job and Drive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.