Red Tornado Posted October 6, 2006 Share Posted October 6, 2006 Some big ones off the bat like TTU and TTR. Also shouldn't American Iron be classed in TTB to start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Shawn M. Posted October 6, 2006 Members Share Posted October 6, 2006 Some big ones off the bat like TTU and TTR. Also shouldn't American Iron be classed in TTB to start. TTC only cuz I like to hear the crying! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falcon Posted October 6, 2006 Share Posted October 6, 2006 Also shouldn't American Iron be classed in TTB to start. WTF???? Any full tilt race car should start in TTR and go up from there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Shawn M. Posted October 6, 2006 Members Share Posted October 6, 2006 WTF???? Any full tilt race car should start in TTR and go up from there! See, like that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firehawkclone Posted October 6, 2006 Share Posted October 6, 2006 Well I think my car should be TTD if an AI car is B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Shawn M. Posted October 6, 2006 Members Share Posted October 6, 2006 Well I think my car should be TTD if an AI car is B Someone needs a whabulance. Wah-wah-wah!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firehawkclone Posted October 6, 2006 Share Posted October 6, 2006 Well I think my car should be TTD if an AI car is B Someone needs a whabulance. Wah-wah-wah!!! Can I cry on your shoulder at BRP next week Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
National Staff Greg G. Posted October 6, 2006 National Staff Share Posted October 6, 2006 TTU and TTR will likely be changing to follow the new race classes that we are developing to fit between PTA and SU. So, there will likely be another TT class added up there. You guys can feel free to discuss all you want (and obviously I read these forums); however, all changes are going to hinge on the ability to crossover and back from TT_ to the new race classes. AI cars are welcome to run in TTB if they classify there by points Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
860TTC Posted October 6, 2006 Share Posted October 6, 2006 Also shouldn't American Iron be classed in TTB to start. WTF???? Any full tilt race car should start in TTR and go up from there! WTF!!! An AI has a higher power to weight ratio than the TTC Nationals Champion and runner up. Scared? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Tornado Posted October 6, 2006 Author Share Posted October 6, 2006 Actually AI being classed in TTA seems about right as there times and ares were almost dead on for the top 3 folks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trackboss Posted October 7, 2006 Share Posted October 7, 2006 Keep in mind that AI cars are restricted in hp and weight so if a fully legal AI car were to run tt there is a good chance a street car also in the same class would have WAY more hp and bigger tires. It is still a bit unfair to run a full tilt race car in the A group. However, in the groups above anything other than an SU car is probably out classed if taken to the limit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted October 16, 2006 Share Posted October 16, 2006 I want to see some stuff allowed for free... like camber kinda unfair that some cars come with a huge adjustment range factory and can take advantage points-free and others get charged for using "factory" camber bolts either charge ALL people for being outside of factory specs (gay, but fair) or allow changes points-free. I think its not that logical to allow HVAC removal points-free (pretty unnessecary for track prep of a street car outside of weight considerations) but charge someone for setting thier car up properly... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timz06 Posted October 16, 2006 Share Posted October 16, 2006 I ran my 95 camaro in TTB at roebling and ran a 1:22.4.. The AI pole was 1:21.4 so TTB may not be too far off for AI, probably TTA would be a better guess. My biggest concern was obvious cheating (a TTB porsche 996 car that should have been a TTR car.) and no policing or anyone to complain to. I also saw that at road atlanta a TTB car ran 1:34 (nissan silva.) This is obvioulsy impossible, and these cars should be removed from the results. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
National Staff Greg G. Posted October 16, 2006 National Staff Share Posted October 16, 2006 My biggest concern was obvious cheating (a TTB porsche 996 car that should have been a TTR car.) and no policing or anyone to complain to. All protests should go through the Regional TT Director (or acting TT Director at the event). There should always be someone there to "complain" to. I also saw that at road atlanta a TTB car ran 1:34 (nissan silva.) This is obvioulsy impossible, and these cars should be removed from the results. Tim You are correct. I believe we determined that the particular car you mentioned is a TTR car based on HP rating (it is at least a TTU car). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timz06 Posted October 16, 2006 Share Posted October 16, 2006 Thanks for answering Greg...I don't think the regional director was present at the event. Myself and a fellow TTB competitor were a bit frustrated. We are doing this for fun, and didn't want to make a big deal out of this. I am going to continue with time trials next year, and I wanted to know the procedure. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 kinda unfair that some cars come with a huge adjustment range factory and can take advantage points-free and others get charged for using "factory" camber bolts that replace obsolete, bad design, no longer made bolts ahem I'd be all for taking the points if everyone else thats outside of factory specs is taking points too... its really the same mod, sucks that some have to take points for it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firehawkclone Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 I want to see some stuff allowed for free... like camber kinda unfair that some cars come with a huge adjustment range factory and can take advantage points-free and others get charged for using "factory" camber bolts either charge ALL people for being outside of factory specs (gay, but fair) or allow changes points-free. I think its not that logical to allow HVAC removal points-free (pretty unnessecary for track prep of a street car outside of weight considerations) but charge someone for setting thier car up properly... Sometimes you get lucky with a mod on your car of choice! I know both side's of this all to well! I had to take +5(+6 if they had hiem joints) for non-adjustable upper a-arms at $250, just so I could get over 1 deg of camber! They provide no other major gain on my car. So I see you as the lucky one with your +2 $20 camber bolts HVAC is +1 and +1 for any other dash parts removed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Air conditioning and condenser removal only = 0 you would hope base classing would take care of the whole "camber" issue, unless you're basing stuff loosely around SCCA Solo2, which would allow my $5 replacement bolts (thank you Toyota Parts counter hook-up) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firehawkclone Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Air conditioning and condenser removal only = 0 you would hope base classing would take care of the whole "camber" issue, unless you're basing stuff loosely around SCCA Solo2, which would allow my $5 replacement bolts (thank you Toyota Parts counter hook-up) AC and Condenser is free, but you stated the HVAC in your prior post Ken. $5 bucks! Yeah your one of the lucky ones big time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbrew8991 Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 yeah I realized after I looked it up that they arent exactly interchangeable words... whoops regardless, i think its pretty flipping silly to not charge points for that outright. and its kinda silly to slap some people for camber and not others... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slowoldpoop Posted November 6, 2006 Share Posted November 6, 2006 Three suggestions: 1. I was appalled to find that I am running door to door with cars having no roll bars in HPDE4/TT. This is insane! I recommend that the rules be changed to require a roll bar in the TT classes. Cost? A bolt in bar doesn't cost that much more than a good helmet. 2. National Championships. It is my understanding that all anyone has to do to enter the Nationals is enter five events, and complete at least one timed lap at each event. Hmmm. Some national championship. I recommend amending the rules to state that only the top five cars in each class from each region are eligible to enter the nationals. Further, if too many cars enter a particular class at the nationals, then preference shall be given to the top cars in each region. Ideally, the nationals should be a runoff among regional winners. This would encourage national entrants to finish well in their regions, not just enter and do a lap. 3. As I understand it, anyone can enter any car at the Nationals. In other words, I could rent a specially-built car just to win my class. For TT, I recommend amending the rules to state that points belong to the car and driver, so that the car entered at the nationals be the same car that won regional points. Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Shawn M. Posted November 6, 2006 Members Share Posted November 6, 2006 Three suggestions: 1. I was appalled to find that I am running door to door with cars having no roll bars in HPDE4/TT. This is insane! I recommend that the rules be changed to require a roll bar in the TT classes. Cost? A bolt in bar doesn't cost that much more than a good helmet. Rich appalled? Then you should have pulled off the track, in the interest of safety, right? Why stop there? Why not require full driving suit, gloves, fire proof undergarments, Hans device, window net, fire extinguisher system, 5 pt belts, ect. If your car is set up with a full cage, dont worry about what everyone else has or doesnt have. They (we) all know the risks of driving at any track event with the safety gear they have -VS- whats available to them. The bottom line is, you are not running door to door. You are running against the clock and nobody else. Its my understanding that the TT was brought in as a format for all the poor bastards (like myself) who cant afford to go real racing, a venue to compete with their street driven cars. I have no issues with your #2 and #3! p.s. I do have a full cage and full safety equipment in my car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slowoldpoop Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 If your car is set up with a full cage, dont worry about what everyone else has or doesnt have. They (we) all know the risks of driving at any track event with the safety gear they have -VS- whats available to them. The bottom line is, you are not running door to door. You are running against the clock and nobody else. Its my understanding that the TT was brought in as a format for all the poor bastards (like myself) who cant afford to go real racing, a venue to compete with their street driven cars. I have no issues with your #2 and #3! p.s. I do have a full cage and full safety equipment in my car. I, too, have a full cage and safety equipment. I am running door to door with guys who don't even have a bar. I think that's appalling. I agree that TT is a first step to real racing, and a training ground for the day when I (we) do go real racing. But a bar is part of a first step in car prep. It's pretty basic stuff, and should be part of the rules. I dunno what it's like in whatever class you are in, but TTB is prit near "real racing." It gets pretty scary out there sometimes, running three abreast in a pack of cars, with the TTU cars screaming by and the TTDs trying to get out of the way. Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firehawkclone Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 If your car is set up with a full cage, dont worry about what everyone else has or doesnt have. They (we) all know the risks of driving at any track event with the safety gear they have -VS- whats available to them. The bottom line is, you are not running door to door. You are running against the clock and nobody else. Its my understanding that the TT was brought in as a format for all the poor bastards (like myself) who cant afford to go real racing, a venue to compete with their street driven cars. I have no issues with your #2 and #3! p.s. I do have a full cage and full safety equipment in my car. I, too, have a full cage and safety equipment. I am running door to door with guys who don't even have a bar. I think that's appalling. I agree that TT is a first step to real racing, and a training ground for the day when I (we) do go real racing. But a bar is part of a first step in car prep. It's pretty basic stuff, and should be part of the rules. I dunno what it's like in whatever class you are in, but TTB is prit near "real racing." It gets pretty scary out there sometimes, running three abreast in a pack of cars, with the TTU cars screaming by and the TTDs trying to get out of the way. Rich Rich, I agree with you somewhat, but this is TT not racing, "I" don't go W2W unless I know that driver. So if you catch or are cuaght in a corner, that lap is no good any way. No need to take that risk! If you start mandating a bar/cage than you have just another race series. And the cost goes up alot, and most of the time the seats and belts are not installed right. Will the bar help? yes! But it may hurt them to. And TTB is not racing, the speeds are fast though. Fast enough for me to install a bar/seat/harness last winter! And will change it to a full cage this winter. Your concerns are valid though, BUT.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GooRoo Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Yeah, I think the others are correct too. You may feel like you're going door to door, but then you should step back and change your approach. If you get near someone on a particular lap and are slowed by them, even one second, then it's probably not going to be your best lap. Slow down, get past when it's easy/safe to do and then prep for your next hot lap. There's a fair amount of tactics involved here. And of course all of that depends on the track, the other drivers, the way you're being released onto the track, what you are supposed to be doing for the first lap, the rules, the weather, which session of the day it is, etc etc etc. TT is definitely not just - go out there and drive as hard as you can all session - at least not if you want to place. Just ask the racers about their qualifying. I *may* get one clean hot lap per session, probably less if there's alot of people. All the others I have some sort of issue. None of this generally bothers me though, as I'm out there mainly for fun, and I find the tactics portion nearly as fun as the actual driving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.