AI Coupe Driver Posted October 18, 2006 Posted October 18, 2006 Planning to order my Kirkey Deluxe Road Race Seat ($$$) and now I see I have to make the same available for an instructor as I go through the license process. Is that true? I'm building a 89 Coupe to get back into racing (SCCA & EMRA) after way too many years of doing the family thing! AI looks like the place to be. Thanks for any input on the second seat subject. Ron Quote
Pat L. Posted October 18, 2006 Posted October 18, 2006 What licensing group are you running with? I ran with Driving Concepts a little over a year ago and they didn't use the passenger seat... not sure if they required it, but they def. didn't use it. Quote
white_2kgt Posted October 18, 2006 Posted October 18, 2006 If you are new and need to start at the begining w/ NASA in their HPDE program a 2nd seat will be needed. If you are just looking to do a license test to go racing (meaning you already HAVE experience, verifiable of course) then you will not need a passenger seat, the COMP eval school will pair you up with another car. Quote
JKnight Posted October 18, 2006 Posted October 18, 2006 The passenger needs to have the same level of safety equipment as the driver, but I don't think that they need to have the same type of seat. So you could have a really nice (expensive) driver's seat, and a relatively inexpensive passenger seat. Although the passenger seat would have to have a harness, as opposed to a three point seat belt (assuming driver has a harness). Is that what you're asking? Jason Quote
white_2kgt Posted October 18, 2006 Posted October 18, 2006 The passenger needs to have the same level of safety equipment as the driver... That is incorrect. This is the rule, 11.4.8 Seatbelts and HarnessesThe seatbelts should be in good condition. No damage may be present on the seatbelts and they must be the factory configuration. Any harness or any restraint system, other than factory stock, shall conform to CCR section #15.5, in all respects* except for the expiration regulations. Harnesses that are expired for racing may be used providing that they are in at least very good condition. The use of a lap belt without any shoulder restraint is not permitted. Passenger seatbelts must meet the same minimum requirements as the driver seatbelts if being used by a passenger. *Aftermarket DOTcertified belt sets, installed to the manufacture’s specifications may be allowed. Proof of DOT certification and proper installation is the driver’s responsibility. Notice that just says that the belt must meat the same specs as the drivers seatbelt. Nowhere does it say they have to be equal. The driver can have a 6pt 06 harness and the passenger can have a stock 3pt DOT belt because that is the MIN requirements. This is the 2nd most incorrectly interperted rule behind rollbars being required in open top cars. Quote
AI Coupe Driver Posted October 18, 2006 Author Posted October 18, 2006 Since I haven't raced since the early 80's I don't have a problem going through the HPDE process if I have to, but, I would be using the AI (89 Mustang) car. I plan to build a proper and well prepared car for the class and would want to get as much seat time as possible... are there many (any) race prepped cars used in the HPDE process. And... I see the 3 point factory seat belt is OK but can I use a factory passenger seat if I have a proper cross brace behind it? I live in Columbus Ohio and plan to do my first year at Mid Ohio events. Thanks again. Looking forward to meeting some new faces. Ron Quote
racercosmo Posted October 19, 2006 Posted October 19, 2006 The passenger needs to have the same level of safety equipment as the driver... That is incorrect. This is the rule, 11.4.8 Seatbelts and HarnessesThe seatbelts should be in good condition. No damage may be present on the seatbelts and they must be the factory configuration. Any harness or any restraint system, other than factory stock, shall conform to CCR section #15.5, in all respects* except for the expiration regulations. Harnesses that are expired for racing may be used providing that they are in at least very good condition. The use of a lap belt without any shoulder restraint is not permitted. Passenger seatbelts must meet the same minimum requirements as the driver seatbelts if being used by a passenger. *Aftermarket DOTcertified belt sets, installed to the manufacture’s specifications may be allowed. Proof of DOT certification and proper installation is the driver’s responsibility. Notice that just says that the belt must meat the same specs as the drivers seatbelt. Nowhere does it say they have to be equal. The driver can have a 6pt 06 harness and the passenger can have a stock 3pt DOT belt because that is the MIN requirements. This is the 2nd most incorrectly interperted rule behind rollbars being required in open top cars. I was under the impression that racecars required 5 or 6 point harnesses for the driver. Quote
AI Coupe Driver Posted October 19, 2006 Author Posted October 19, 2006 What I was trying to say was the passenger belt (based on what I am reading here) can be a factory belt. I plan to use a five or six point belt. Sorry. Quote
white_2kgt Posted October 19, 2006 Posted October 19, 2006 The passenger needs to have the same level of safety equipment as the driver... That is incorrect. This is the rule, 11.4.8 Seatbelts and HarnessesThe seatbelts should be in good condition. No damage may be present on the seatbelts and they must be the factory configuration. Any harness or any restraint system, other than factory stock, shall conform to CCR section #15.5, in all respects* except for the expiration regulations. Harnesses that are expired for racing may be used providing that they are in at least very good condition. The use of a lap belt without any shoulder restraint is not permitted. Passenger seatbelts must meet the same minimum requirements as the driver seatbelts if being used by a passenger. *Aftermarket DOTcertified belt sets, installed to the manufacture’s specifications may be allowed. Proof of DOT certification and proper installation is the driver’s responsibility. Notice that just says that the belt must meat the same specs as the drivers seatbelt. Nowhere does it say they have to be equal. The driver can have a 6pt 06 harness and the passenger can have a stock 3pt DOT belt because that is the MIN requirements. This is the 2nd most incorrectly interperted rule behind rollbars being required in open top cars. I was under the impression that racecars required 5 or 6 point harnesses for the driver. For racing, yes. How may passengers do you see in an AI race? If he takes out a passenger he's going to be in HPDE, which is where I quoted those rules from, therefore, all that is required for the driver is a 3pt belt, therefore, that is all that is required for the passenger. Make sense? What I was trying to say was the passenger belt (based on what I am reading here) can be a factory belt. I plan to use a five or six point belt.Sorry. yea, a Factory DOT 3pt belt in good working order. Now, some instructors may see you in your race bucket, rollcage and 6pt belt and look in the passenger seat and see a worn out mustang seat with stock 3pt belt and rollcage inches from their head and refuse to get in the car for safety, that is their call. So be prepared for that. Quote
AI Coupe Driver Posted October 19, 2006 Author Posted October 19, 2006 Really appreciate the info. I know a year or two from now I'll be way past this start up phase, but I want to be careful and not be sent home with NO seat time. Ron Quote
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