SMSP Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 I've started a new thread per civicrr. The Hybrids of H1 are obviously the most prepared vehicles in HC. The cars from outside are stock looking but with the allowable removal items for the interior they are anything but stock in appearance. I know some drivers would love to be able to remove more to help them with weight. I probably won't have a problem getting my weight down under the current rules (as long as I myself loose a few lbs) but there are many vehicles that won't come close to the minimums. The allowance of different material for body panels will help in this regard however, this defeats the goal of keeping costs down. This brings me to my request which I hope other H1 folks will like and the board will seriously entertain. The stock dash: First we are already allowed to remove the heating and A/C stuff. The gauges are worthless to us. The dash gets hacked up to clear the roll cage tubing. But most importantly there are 2 major safety concerns. First when you try to position your butt as low in the car as possible to move your center of gavity down and to gain headroom your vision is somewhat restricted due to the dash board around/above the instrument cluster. Second, in the event of a fire, the dash will generate toxic smoke and will be dangerous to the driver and safety workers. So, I would propose allowing the stock dashboard to be removed but it would have to be replaced with a sheet metal version that would be full width with a front face to aid in gauge installations. On a side note, I believe an onboard fire system should be mandatory, since you'll never stay seated in the car to fight the fire around you. With a system one hand releases the belts and the other pulls the cable. We would never think about racing without belts or a helmet you guys should really start thinking about the consequences of sitting in the middle of a fire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPiFF Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 The HC rules really need to stabilize soon or we run the risk of sending our competitors to debtors prison chasing an always moving set of rules. We can all agree that the snails pace at which IT rules change is a little frustrating, though you can be sure that when you build/buy a car for IT it will be legal and competitive as is for some time. I like the forward thinking and openness of NASA, but the rate at which HC rules are changing year to year is scary. If there is a change to the rules to makes cars cheaper to build, safer, more competitive, etc, then let's do it. But all this useless rule changes to suit the fancy of just a few people should be look at with a very critical eye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thawley Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 While I'm not opposed to the idea of being ALLOWED to use a custom dash, if pains me to think I'll HAVE to build one just to reach competetive weight. I'll end up spending more than I'd like just to get a 91 hatch down to b-series weight as it is. So, if the real complaint is the difficulty in finding options to help make weight, why not just raise all the minimum weights by 50lbs and increase the maximum legal ballast allowed to help the guys already at weight. And as far as the value of the stock gauges, I know at least two guys using stock temp gauges and one who swears by using the speedo to watch courner exit speeds for improving his line. So, are we trying to legislate some some desired fabrication or are we really trying to make it cheaper for everyone in the long run? Thawley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ryan F. Posted May 12, 2004 Members Share Posted May 12, 2004 We will add this topic to the next rules discussion but even if it were allowed it would not be until next year. We are trying to make changes only of they are needed for performance adjustments or rule clarifications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIWI Posted May 12, 2004 Share Posted May 12, 2004 Personally I'm not opposed to the idea of using a custom dash, But my Stock dash is gutted, and I doubt if I could build one that would save any weight at all. And I can see over the top of the stock one just fine. The argument about the fumes from the burning material is about as Stupid as Window nets and Seat belts deteriorating so much that they need to be replaced every two years! That is the dumbest thing I've heard lately and needs to be looked at? I'm sure the Rules committee have plenty of heavier rule problems to consider. Kiwi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMSP Posted May 13, 2004 Author Share Posted May 13, 2004 We will add this topic to the next rules discussion but even if it were allowed it would not be until next year. We are trying to make changes only of they are needed for performance adjustments or rule clarifications. Thank you Ryan. I wanted to get these 2 items clarified. The actual horn body (mounted in the front of the car) can that be removed? If the steering wheel can be replaced you'll loose the horn button(s) so........... Also can the stock instrument panel be replaced with a custom panel? Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ITAIntegraLS Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 In H1 you can remove cluster and just put a TACH if you want. In H2-H5 I dont think its such a good idea to do that. We will add this topic to the next rules discussion but even if it were allowed it would not be until next year. We are trying to make changes only of they are needed for performance adjustments or rule clarifications. Thank you Ryan. I wanted to get these 2 items clarified. The actual horn body (mounted in the front of the car) can that be removed? If the steering wheel can be replaced you'll loose the horn button(s) so........... Also can the stock instrument panel be replaced with a custom panel? Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedracer33 Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 Sounds to me like the easier answer is to adjust the minimum weights instead of allowing something like this. Making this rule change is just going to open the door for every stupid little similar mod. If we allow aluminum dashboards to replace the stock ones, how do you say no the person who wants to run fiberglass fenders? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ITAIntegraLS Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 I tought h1 cars allready do run fiberglass fenders. Sounds to me like the easier answer is to adjust the minimum weights instead of allowing something like this. Making this rule change is just going to open the door for every stupid little similar mod. If we allow aluminum dashboards to replace the stock ones, how do you say no the person who wants to run fiberglass fenders? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vapor Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 I tought h1 cars allready do run fiberglass fenders. yep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ryan F. Posted May 13, 2004 Members Share Posted May 13, 2004 SMSP- You can remove the horn and the operating button. Good catch it is not in the rules and something we will add. As far as the minimum weights, the HC rules committee does realize that the H1 weights may be a little on the light side. The season is still in the early stages and we have been watching the weights on the vehicles. We also understand that the "majority" of participants (people that are actually racing) feel that the 2200# H1 weight is very difficult to achieve. Just know that we are listening and keeping track of actual race car data. We want to make as few changes as possible mid season so time is our best ally to get data and make informed decisions. Thanks to everyone supporting the series. Ryan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMSP Posted May 14, 2004 Author Share Posted May 14, 2004 In H1 you can remove cluster and just put a TACH if you want. In H2-H5 I dont think its such a good idea to do that. Thanks again Ryan. So ITAIntegraLS's comment above is valid also? I just didn't see that in the rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
civicrr Posted May 14, 2004 Share Posted May 14, 2004 Yes. It is in the 2004 rules. H1 only of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMSP Posted May 14, 2004 Author Share Posted May 14, 2004 thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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