Ultra Newbie - Looking for comments and criticism

[V/T Andy]

Hi everyone,

 

I was able to attend my first NASA event with my good friend at Auto Club this past weekend and it was great. I openly admit to being extremely fresh. A while back, I did an event at Willow Springs with another track group and drove my friend's prepped civic only to discover exactly how slow I am haha. Well, I currently drive a 2000 Corvette, but I want to retain that car as my daily driver. It's an automatic, old, and so very reliable. It's just an awesome cruiser, so I don't want to put it to the test. I've been considering several cars as a dedicated track car (except for being able to drive the car to the track.) Everyone says Miata is a great way to go, but somehow, I just can't see myself driving a miata. I'm not knocking Miatas at all, I really like them, but I figure I might as well drive something I like if I'm going to do this. I have been wrenching on cars for some time, primarily for drag racing, and not so much for road racing (read: more engine work than suspension work). I like the 944 and have seen several good deals in my local area (Orange County, CA). Is this a good and reliable car to start with? Is it worth it to go with a non-turbo? I am young, but I intend to do things the right way the first time. From what I've seen, the clutch is a huge issue. Currently, I do not have a full garage with a lift, although that may change in the near future (6mo-1yr). I figure since I'm just starting out, a stockish 944 with or without turbo would be a decent way to go, as well as be reasonable financially. How do you guys feel about it? Would you recommend me go in a different direction? I intend to attend almost every California weekend event with NASA, so if the car could stay unbroken for small periods of time, that would be great.I will be documenting everything from the beginning through www.vtengineering.com so hopefully I will be able to hear more comments and criticism from you guys throughout my journey towards become a halfway decent track driver. I appreciate your input here. If this is in the wrong section, I apologize. Please don't hesitate to move it to the proper channels. Thank you!

 

Andy

[944-Spec#94]

My first track car was an 88 944 Turbo S I ran in 1999. Fun car, but I wanted to keep it for the street (I still have it) and get something for the track.

 

So I picked up a 84 944 that was moslty junk for $1400. This was in 1999 and these days a bit high for what I got.

 

Any way I build that car from the ground up as track and race car. I started slow and just stripped it out, made it safe and ran it on track stock (except for stripped interior). The car was a balast and as fast as my 944 Turbo had been despite having 100 less hp. The speed came form less weight and less concern about damage. This car was already rough so I did not feel bad about writing it off.

 

 

So that was 9 years ago. Today I am still driving that same car and still enjoying it. I have done all prep and maintenance work on the car short of welding in the cage which had done for me. (I am not welder). Everything else from engine rebuilds to aligments have been done at home without a lift.

 

The car has been quite reliable once I restored the mechnicals back to proper condition. When i got the car was non-running iwth 140k miles and number of lingering issues. Now even at 25 years old the car run strong and considering the many track years and 100+ races on the car it has held up well. I consider it a very wise decision to build and run this car. Operating expenses are low since most parts do not break and if they do you replace them once and move on.

 

Now as for the clutch it is a non-issue in these NA cars. It can take time replace it, but do it once and never touch it for 5 years. I got 5 years of hard racing on my clutch before it failed However the surface wear was minor. In 9 year my car has had 3 clutches , Stock original clutch from 87, first stock replacment clutch installed in 2003, replacement cluctch installed in 2008. The clutch is not a concern.

[V/T Andy]

Hmm, well that's very encouraging. I have also been looking into a 924s as I hear they've been tanks at reliability. I understand the cars are very old, so I don't expect any miracles, but it's nice to know they can be made reliable. Another question I have. The car will be driven to/from the track. As far as registration goes, is it difficult to pass inspection and such if I purchase the car from out of state? Does anybody here know what is needed or expected as far as registering an out of state car in CA? Thank you.

 

Andy

[944-Spec#94]

Tim Comeau is your man in So-cal. He raced and won quite a bit in a street legal 924S. He is around here and runs a small 944 shop that build 944 NA for racing or track use. He can give you alot of details on these cars and probably help you find donor cars.

[Tim Comeau]

Thanks, Joe. Got him.

[genikz]

Well, I hope I can help inspire you to buy a 924S/944 and join up! I bought an '88 924S for $1100 and it's been nearly bullet-proof. 163,xxx miles and counting with no major issues. Has never let me down at the track. I haven't even replaced the clutch, timing belt, water pump, or other "major" parts on the car, so I guess I have been lucky

 

Thus far I have spent less than $8000 on the car and couldn't be happier with it. In fact, I just bought a parts car and spare short block for $400! The block looks brand new (as far as the bores go), which is a huge bonus with these cars.

 

Here are some notes and pictures regarding my "build"

http://www.brooksbabies.com/porsche/

 

Cheers,

Chris

[V/T Andy]

Chris, your build up is awesome and it definitely has been an inspiration. For what its worth, I was at the office till 8pm last night reaidng through your buildup. I intend to keep a similar 'journal' using video on my company website. I think your build is awesome. It's nice to see you are in Anaheim so nearby! I actually went to look at a 944 tonight, and after careful careful observation, I saw it was leaking a bit of oil on the right side (opposite the exhaust manifold) right above where the dipstick hose is. Is this a very bad leak to have? Is it extremely expensive or a big headache? I'm not sure where it's coming from. If not, I liked everything else about the car. I can't wait to find the right car and get going with you guys!!!

[schwank]

The problem you describe is either a leaky balance shaft seal or air oil separator seals. Neither are uncommon or particularly difficult to fix.

[V/T Andy]

well, i picked up a car for a good deal! 88 944 5speed. I will post pictures and such later. I have many parts i am selling off immediately such as seats, radio equipment etc. hopefully this leans me towards you guys with the budget idea. I looked through the 944 spec rules and i see my car will not qualify for 944spec at the moment, as it has the "European" body kit on it? I have to delve into whether this is somethign special or just a normal 944 turbo kit or something. Either way, the engine seems good, tranny seems ok, but the car starts, drives in every gear, and doesn't overheat. At the moment, it NEEDS new brake pads and I will pull out the non-functioning power steering. I also have some 18" Porsche Turbo Twist wheels on there with some nice new tires. As far as I can tell, they are extremely new and authentic porsche. These wheels gotta be worth something right? Regardless, I am such a new driver that I will be in HPDE for quite some time before I get into racing. Hopefully selling all these extra parts will help me be able to fund a proper roll cage install. Thanks for the advice on pre purchase inspections, in particular to Tim Comeau for talking to me on the phone. I had a Porsche mechanic look at it. The car apparently sounds (as in noise-wise) worse than it is. The exhaust is banging against the bottom of the car at some point, but its an easy fix. I have what appears to be a stock exhaust ( i wouldnt know any differently) as well as a full 3inch Apex'i catback exhaust. Or maybe its jsut an Apex'i muffler welded on to some 3" pipe. Either way, hopefully that exhaust sells for something too.

 

Step 1...going to get it smogged and registered and insured!

[944-Spec#94]

The wheels are probalby worth more that 90% of the 944 spec donor cars.

 

As for the euro front end... I am not certain what you are talking about other than the euro bumper.

 

A picture would tell us alot and give you an idea of how much work it would take to convert.

[Tim Comeau]

Andy,

Yuh, I was going to say that the wheels would sell for more than the cost of the car.

Let's see the VIN as well.

Hopefully, it starts with WPOAA094.......and not WP0AB094......

Yes, the trick is to sell off all the extras on the way to making it a spec car.

Let's see pics of the body kit or refer to an online catalog that sells fiberglass body parts.

A stock exhaust with the cat will really help it pass smog. It's the seller's job to get the car to pass smog before it sells.

In any case, your journey has started and your 944 has a new custodian. Call me anytime. We'll steer you right.

[V/T Andy]

i have some pictures I will post up in a few minutes. i apologize for the delay, i spent the weekend in vegas for my buddy's bachelor party and hte last few days recovering. So i have some news that has me worried...my VIN is WPOAB.....what does that B mean?

[V/T Andy]

 

I apologize for the crappy pics...cell phone pics.

[944-Spec#94]

Ok it has the turbo front end. That is not legal.

 

 

You will need

 

NA fenders (both left and right)

Front NA Spoiler

Front NA bumper

Solid NA header panel (between head lights).

 

Everything should bolt up.

[V/T Andy]

yea thats what i figured at the bare minimum. Thats all right though. At the moment, I am the farthest thing away from being able to race that I can deal wtih that when it gets there. I have many many HPDEs between now and my first race. But i am looking forward to the whole process and learning from you guys!

[Tim Comeau]

Andy,

 

Hey! Cool!

Don't worry about making your 944 into a spec car.

Here's the lowdown..............you have a euro 944 according to the VIN.

Your car has an entire turbo front end except for the header panel and headlight covers. The header panel is from a 924 turbo, which is still cool as hell!

Pretty sexy bitch if you ask me! Just drive it!

But do come out and hang with the 944 gang at the NASA races1

[genikz]

Wow, that's a good looking car! I agree with Tim. Just drive that one as is and buy another car to build into a Spec car.

 

If you haven't already, consider joining PCA and coming out to the auto-cross events at El Toro, in Irvine. They'll be demolishing the runways soon, so get out there while you can! It's the best $60 you can spend because you can bring whatever you have, prepped to whatever level you like, and drive the snot out of it. There's nothing to hit but the occassional cone.

 

www.pcaocr.org

 

Obviously, still build a Spec car, but this will give you the chance to get your feet wet and scratch that itch to be on track. The auto-cross events will help with your HPDE progress as well, because you get to practice car control in a controlled, safe environment.

 

Chris

PM me if you want to chat or meet up

[V/T Andy]

Thanks guys. i definitely will get in touch with you soon. The first thing finalyl went out on my car. Seems it will be a pain to fix. The odometer froze for some reason. I found the trip odo reset and pushed it but now its not doing anyhting. All the other gauges work. Both the trip odo and the permanent odo have frozen now. Do you guys know what I might be able to do to fix it? Thanks.

[genikz]

This may help:

http://www.clarks-garage.com/shop-manual/elect-09.htm

[V/T Andy]

Sweet man, thanks! We will meet up soon and do a little trip through Ortega highway or something.

[Tim Comeau]

It's not part of my racing/performance experience, but I'm told that if you push in the reset "button" on the vent grill while the car is moving, it will strip the plastic gears in that gauge.

[V/T Andy]

Yea, oh well. Doesn't seem like too bad of a task to pull the gauges out. Is it really necessary to use the gauge face tool as shown?

 

Also...additional pluses and minuses i've found out about my car. So I don't know if it has to do with the car being a Euro car or what, but are all your parking brakes on your left in between yourself and the door? I just ask because I saw some center consoles with space for the parking brake. Regardless, that doesn't really bother me in the least.

 

Plus: the whole sunroof comes out! Sweet! Still haven't tried it yet but its cool to know that it can.

Plus: theres two garment hooks in the car. Sweet!

Plus: $229 to insure the car for a whole year with AAA. Nice!

Minus: theres zero cupholders in the car. NOT sweet. and the two indents in the glove compartment after folding down don't count because my hinge thing is broke and it just flops down.

Minus: looks like i will be removing the power steering pump which is held in by some strange hangar contraption or something. I knew about it but then i forgot about it and i was reminded about it.

[944cer]

Cool. Enjoy the new ride! My parking brake was on the left of the seat.

[Cheap_Thrills]

That is a good looking car. With the amount of donor cars out there, it's almost a shame to turn that one into a Spec car. But then again, you could probably part out most of it and pay for ALOT of your build costs. Mine had almost flawless interior, but it was all donated to charity (my brother's 944).

Is that a harness bar behind the seat? If so, it looks very flimsy. I don't think they'd let you use that in HPDE, better off sticking with the factory belts.

[V/T Andy]

Thanks guys. The car is really nice looking, and maybe it is a shame, but that is why I will drive it as is for now. It is a second car for me, and the car seems in general good shape mechanically which is important to me. Like you said, there are a lot of parts on there that I will be able to sell off to help with the build. The interior is extremely clean, and I like that. I do not have a harness bar, what you see is probably when the back seat was folded down, the tops of the seats. I do plan on putting a cage in the car. Soon, the rear seats, the wheels, an extra exhaust, the steering wheel, some of the radio equipment inside the car, and most likely the front seats will be for sale. I figure that should pay for a good portion of my build. Regardless, my driving skill is so far from racing it will be some time before i ever race, so i can take the time with the build. The car already has Koni's so that is good. My focus at the moment will be to replace the wheels with some phone dials and good tires. The wheels on there now are nice, but I personally feel like they are too big for the car. I like the stock look. Got any place online that is a good place to look for some stock wheels?

 

I also want to install new rotors and pads. I was thinking of trying to find stock rotors at NAPA or something and I'm not sure what pads would be good. Any recommendations? Thanks guys. I hope to make this build based greatly on community input.

 

I also plan on changing the motor oil, tranny fluid, coolant, and diff oil(if its easy to get to with just a jack). What fluids woudl you guys recommend? Thanks. I've been trying to use 944-online.org but I'm open to other forums as well.

 

BTW, i took the top off last night. took like 20 minutes to get it back on since i didnt know how. Minus for that.

 

Also, i notice that when I'm driving, the temp gauge stays 1 hair above the first tick, but when i come to a stop for a while, the temp gauge climbs fairly high, almost to the 3rd tick. Is this normal?

 

sorry for the random thoughts.