Official H1 rules ruling please: Int. Man & Head porting

[jmeris]

Just wanted people's opinion and a CLEAR official H1 ruling on whether or not (for K-series engines, such as the K20) Intake Manifolds can have the water port CUT-OFF of the manifold flange??

 

In other words, IS IT LEGAL TO CUT-OFF THE WATER PORT section of the Intake manifold, or does it need to remain on the manifold in order to be legal.

 

More specifically, the RBC and RRC manifolds have the water port incorporated into the flange. On the K20a, K20a2, and K24a1 heads, the water port of the head uses a separate water port that is NOT part of the the intake manifold. To allow the RBC/RRC Intake manifolds to be used on these heads above, the water port on the Intake manifold MUST BE CUT OFF.

 

Some racers say it IS LEGAL because of this rule:

9.3.1 H1 Hybrid Vehicle Engine Preparation

This section is intended to clarify the engine preparation rules specific to Hybrid Vehicles.

"d) Items that attach to the cylinder head may be re-drilled for fitment purposes ONLY. Alteration of air and

fuel passages is not permitted. Fitment modifications that alter air and fuel, as a side effect will be

deemed illegal." (the assumption is that since it is a water passage, it CAN be modified)

 

BUT according to the preceding rule:

"c) Intake Manifolds are not considered part of the cylinder head and must be unmodified OEM Honda parts. Port matching is allowed but cannot be machined beyond one (1) inch into the intake manifold."

 

Also wanted to clarify that K-SERIES cylinder heads ARE ALLOWED UNRESTRICTED PORTING? At least that's my take from:

 

9.3 H1 Hybrid Vehicles Only

"• Engine cylinder head porting (“from the block up”)"

and

9.3.1 H1 Hybrid Vehicle Engine Preparation

This section is intended to clarify the engine preparation rules specific to Hybrid Vehicles.

 

"b) “Above the engine block” cylinder head preparation and porting is unrestricted. Valve size and material

must conform to original specification for that particular head. Rocker shaft assemblies are also

unrestricted."

 

An official ruling would be greatly appreciated...

thanks

jmeris

[GI8U2racing]

I don't run H1, but it was my understanding that you cannot port K-series heads, I certainly could be wrong, though.

Here is where I see it mentioning it in the rules:

 

9.3.1 H1 Hybrid Vehicle Engine Preparation

e) K Series cylinder head must use unmodified OEM camshafts and rocker assembly that is sold with K

series cylinder head. JDM is considered OEM and permitted. K series are allowed the use of steel or

Stainless steel valves. Cylinder head preparation must conform to rules in 8.1 (e) and (g). Valve face

where it mates to the seat may be machined and valve seats may be machined for the purposes of a

valve job.

 

8.1 Engine

e) Cylinder head intake ports, exhaust ports, and intake manifold may be port matched but cannot be

machined beyond one (1) inch into the head or intake.

g) Valve guide material is unrestricted. However, shape and size must remain the same as OEM.

[Another Drew]

Have you heard anything more official? I'm curious too since I have a k20a.

[jmeris]

Have you heard anything more official? I'm curious too since I have a k20a.

 

I HAVE NOT HEARD ANYTHING on this subject. Nothing official at all. If someone on the rules committee could make a ruling, we'd greatly appreciate it , (Jeremy? Brian Z? Sam?)

 

I don't run H1, but it was my understanding that you cannot port K-series heads, I certainly could be wrong, though.

Here is where I see it mentioning it in the rules:

 

9.3.1 H1 Hybrid Vehicle Engine Preparation

e) K Series cylinder head must use unmodified OEM camshafts and rocker assembly that is sold with K

series cylinder head. JDM is considered OEM and permitted. K series are allowed the use of steel or

Stainless steel valves. Cylinder head preparation must conform to rules in 8.1 (e) and (g). Valve face

where it mates to the seat may be machined and valve seats may be machined for the purposes of a

valve job.

 

8.1 Engine

e) Cylinder head intake ports, exhaust ports, and intake manifold may be port matched but cannot be

machined beyond one (1) inch into the head or intake.

g) Valve guide material is unrestricted. However, shape and size must remain the same as OEM.

 

Hi Jonathan,

I would agree that you're correct BUT according to:

9.1 Introductory Notes

a) This section of the rules are to be read as an addition to, or replacement of, the rules for car preparation

listed in sections pertaining to section 7 General Modifications and section 8 Allowed Modifications (H1-

H5).

b) Rules listed within section 9 may be in contradiction with those listed in section 7 and 8. In these cases,

the Allowed Modifications (H1 Only) in section 9 supersede those in sections pertaining to Allowed

Modifications in section 7 and 8 (H1-H5).

 

To clarify this rule:

c) In section 9 of the rulebook, the description of a component of a race car as “unrestricted” implies that

any part, from any manufacturer (Honda or otherwise) may be used to construct said component(s).

 

And because of:

9.3 H1 Hybrid Vehicles Only

"• Engine cylinder head porting (“from the block up”)"

and

9.3.1 H1 Hybrid Vehicle Engine Preparation

This section is intended to clarify the engine preparation rules specific to Hybrid Vehicles.

"b) “Above the engine block” cylinder head preparation and porting is unrestricted. Valve size and material

must conform to original specification for that particular head. Rocker shaft assemblies are also

unrestricted."

 

I would conclude that PORTING IS LEGAL on K-Series H1 engines.

 

Also, is cutting the water port off the (RBC or RRC) K series intake manifold legal?

 

thanks guys

[GI8U2racing]

I bet nobody in H1 running a K-series is ported, between your ability to build an engine within the rules plus having a ported engine, you'd walk everyone like crazy!

 

I dare you to do it, and give H1 a try, go create a ruffle in H1 this year to mix it up a bit

 

Why is no one from the rules committee responding? Kind of odd

[jmeris]

I bet nobody in H1 running a K-series is ported, between your ability to build an engine within the rules plus having a ported engine, you'd walk everyone like crazy!

 

Lol! Nah...there's no way!! Kevin Helms is on FIRE!!!

 

I dare you to do it, and give H1 a try, go create a ruffle in H1 this year to mix it up a bit

 

Deja Vu

[Jeremy C.]

I don't run H1, but it was my understanding that you cannot port K-series heads, I certainly could be wrong, though.

Here is where I see it mentioning it in the rules:

 

9.3.1 H1 Hybrid Vehicle Engine Preparation

e) K Series cylinder head must use unmodified OEM camshafts and rocker assembly that is sold with K

series cylinder head. JDM is considered OEM and permitted. K series are allowed the use of steel or

Stainless steel valves. Cylinder head preparation must conform to rules in 8.1 (e) and (g). Valve face

where it mates to the seat may be machined and valve seats may be machined for the purposes of a

valve job.

 

8.1 Engine

e) Cylinder head intake ports, exhaust ports, and intake manifold may be port matched but cannot be

machined beyond one (1) inch into the head or intake.

g) Valve guide material is unrestricted. However, shape and size must remain the same as OEM.

 

 

This is correct.

Any play on the "wording" will ultimately fail in the end because the rules CLEARLY state that the K series cyl head is an exception and must follow the 8.1e, g rules for prep. I think that's been pretty clear for the last couple years now.

The logic you are using still doesn't explain away the fact that the rule that says you "can't" port is listed in section 9.3.1. So, it indeed still applies and the K series is not permitted cyl head porting.

 

 

Regarding the manifold question, I think you answered if yourself. The manifold must be an unmodified OEM Honda part.

 

Hope that clears up any confusion.

[jmeris]

I don't run H1, but it was my understanding that you cannot port K-series heads, I certainly could be wrong, though.

Here is where I see it mentioning it in the rules:

 

9.3.1 H1 Hybrid Vehicle Engine Preparation

e) K Series cylinder head must use unmodified OEM camshafts and rocker assembly that is sold with K

series cylinder head. JDM is considered OEM and permitted. K series are allowed the use of steel or

Stainless steel valves. Cylinder head preparation must conform to rules in 8.1 (e) and (g). Valve face

where it mates to the seat may be machined and valve seats may be machined for the purposes of a

valve job.

 

8.1 Engine

e) Cylinder head intake ports, exhaust ports, and intake manifold may be port matched but cannot be

machined beyond one (1) inch into the head or intake.

g) Valve guide material is unrestricted. However, shape and size must remain the same as OEM.

 

 

This is correct.

Any play on the "wording" will ultimately fail in the end because the rules CLEARLY state that the K series cyl head is an exception and must follow the 8.1e, g rules for prep. I think that's been pretty clear for the last couple years now.

The logic you are using still doesn't explain away the fact that the rule that says you "can't" port is listed in section 9.3.1. So, it indeed still applies and the K series is not permitted cyl head porting.

 

 

Regarding the manifold question, I think you answered if yourself. The manifold must be an unmodified OEM Honda part.

 

Hope that clears up any confusion.

 

Yes cleared up the confusion. Thanks for the clarification, official ruling and reply

Wasn't trying to make a play on words nor the rules, just want to make sure everyone, including myself was on the same page. I hadn't run H1 in 2 years and even back then, I ran the B20's so, I didn't pay close attention to the K-series section of the H1 rules

[Jeremy C.]

 

Yes cleared up the confusion. Thanks for the clarification, official ruling and reply

Wasn't trying to make a play on words nor the rules, just want to make sure everyone, including myself was on the same page. I hadn't run H1 in 2 years and even back then, I ran the B20's so, I didn't pay close attention to the K-series section of the H1 rules

 

 

No worries bud! Glad you asked the question first instead of asking it after the fact! Smart in my opinion!

Glad I could help!

[EJO]

Why are you asking questions about H1? You're going to continue running H2...You ARE going to continue running H2...YOU ARE GOING TO CONTINUE RUNNING H2.

 

 

YOU ARE GOING TO CONTINUE RUNNING H2.

[EJO]

Didn't Bernardo, Andre, and Graham run the Intake Manifold with the water port cut out??

[JohnW]

Didn't Bernardo, Andre, and Graham run the Intake Manifold with the water port cut out??

 

I'd sure like to see an answer to that question.

[jmeris]

Didn't Bernardo, Andre, and Graham run the Intake Manifold with the water port cut out??

 

I'd sure like to see an answer to that question.

 

When Andrie won the Championship in '06, he had the complete K20a (DC5) Type R (PRC) engine-which includes the PRC/Type R intake manifold and head. With that said, the water port on that manifold is NOT part of the intake manifold. The cast of the flange of the PRC/Type R manifold does NOT have a provision for a water port as the water port is its own separate entity just like the K20a2 and K20z1 (Type S) engines.

 

In '08, '09, '10, Graham ran the K20z3/RBC ('06 Civic SI) Head and Manifold. The water port was NOT cut off the intake manifold as it is part of the flange and mated to the (RBC) original K20z3 head (RBC/K20z3 intake manifold mated to RBC/k20z3 cylinder head)-thus NOT NEEDING to be cut off.

 

Hope that clarifies your questions