Modded Evolution & Modded GTI 2.8L

[RandyEvo]

Ok first off, reading the rules I end up in TTS with the Evo

3480 pds / 415 whp

That because I have an upgraded turbocharger

 

The GTI 2.8L is naturally aspirated, but I plan on making it turbo with around 300 whp to play around. Where Im going to end up? TTS same as the EVO or what? What will be my base class if I change it to turbo, now my base class is TTF.

 

Some input is well appreciated.

Thanks

[Greg G.]

Ok first off, reading the rules I end up in TTS with the Evo

3480 pds / 415 whp

That because I have an upgraded turbocharger

 

The GTI 2.8L is naturally aspirated, but I plan on making it turbo with around 300 whp to play around. Where Im going to end up? TTS same as the EVO or what? What will be my base class if I change it to turbo, now my base class is TTF.

 

Some input is well appreciated.

Thanks

 

It would depend on the minimum competition weight of the vehicle, and the actual fwhp. But, it would probably be near TTC** if the minimum competition weight was near the curb weight.

[warrtalon]

3480/415 = 8.38, which is TTU unless you're getting .4 mod points for running 275s or less.

Edited February 21, 2007 by Guest

[MrTea]

again, hard call as with the evo and the new classing. changing the turbo or adding a turbo requires new base classing, so track setup dyno (highest hp on the track) and track weight would be needed to figure out classing. depeding on what your pushingk, you could end up anywhere.

[kbrew8991]

3480/415 = 8.38, which is TTU unless you're getting .5 mod points for running really small tires.

 

weight credit + 4 door credit should put him over 8.7:1 fairly easily iirc

[Greg G.]

3480/415 = 8.38, which is TTU unless you're getting .5 mod points for running really small tires.

 

weight credit + 4 door credit should put him over 8.7:1 fairly easily iirc

 

3480/415 = 8.38 - 0.5 (AWD) + 0.4 (4-door sedan) + 0.2 (weight >3300) + 0.4 (275 or less tire size) = 8.88 = TTS

 

Without the 275 or less tire size, the car would be TTU if it makes that much power.

[warrtalon]

3480/415 = 8.38, which is TTU unless you're getting .5 mod points for running really small tires.

 

weight credit + 4 door credit should put him over 8.7:1 fairly easily iirc

 

But we have an AWD penalty that negates the weight and 4-door bonuses.

[kbrew8991]

5 for AWD

4 and 2 for doors & weight

 

you come out 0.1 ahead, geez

[Greg G.]

5 for AWD

4 and 2 for doors & weight

 

you come out 0.1 ahead, geez

No, you come out 0.1 behind--see my post.

[kbrew8991]

5 for AWD

4 and 2 for doors & weight

 

you come out 0.1 ahead, geez

No, you come out 0.1 behind--see my post.

 

I can't suck at math that bad

 

3480/415 = 8.38 - 0.5 (AWD) + 0.4 (4-door sedan) + 0.2 (weight >3300) + 0.4 (275 or less tire size) = 8.88 = TTS

 

-0.5 , + 0.4, + 0.2 = + 0.1. now because his pw:weight is a little too nice, he's gotta use the tire size credit to sneak back in under the cap

 

or am I really just missing it that badly?

[Shawn M.]

or am I really just missing it that badly?

 

 

Depends on what subject your talking about at the time. DOH!

Yeah I know, was too easy. Had to.

[Greg G.]

5 for AWD

4 and 2 for doors & weight

 

you come out 0.1 ahead, geez

No, you come out 0.1 behind--see my post.

 

I can't suck at math that bad

 

3480/415 = 8.38 - 0.5 (AWD) + 0.4 (4-door sedan) + 0.2 (weight >3300) + 0.4 (275 or less tire size) = 8.88 = TTS

 

-0.5 , + 0.4, + 0.2 = + 0.1. now because his pw:weight is a little too nice, he's gotta use the tire size credit to sneak back in under the cap

 

or am I really just missing it that badly?

 

No, sorry, I thought you were just talking about the AWD and 4-door sedan (net of -0.1)--didn't see that you included the weight factor (net +0.1).

[RandyEvo]

I run 255 tires.

As far as my calculations it went like this:

 

3480/415 = 8.38 + .4 (4 door sedan) + .4 (less than 275 tire) - .5 (AWD Penalty) which left me in 8.6855422, plus the + .2 for the weight its 8.88 like Gregg said. So I stay in TTS

[warrtalon]

Which brings us full circle to me saying that it's too high of a ratio unless you have small tires. I think we're all clear. I'm just surprised that pig weighs over 100lbs more than my pig when I have no weight reduction and I weigh 225...

[Greg G.]

Maybe Randy weighs 325 lbs--I've got some pretty big boys in my region that are in the high 200's and in the 300's.

[RandyEvo]

I have no weight reduction Warr, and Im 6'2" 215

If I did weight reduction I definately would be in TTU, but since this is my daily driver.

[warrtalon]

I have no weight reduction Warr, and Im 6'2" 215

If I did weight reduction I definately would be in TTU, but since this is my daily driver.

 

That's why I was surprised by your weight. Mine is my daily driver, and I have no weight reduction either, but at 6'2 225, my MR is 3367 with under 1/4 tank of gas. Do you have an SSL model? That's the only model heavier than the MR. Trying to figure out why yours is so heavy. Do you race with the spare tire, jack, and tools still in the trunk?

[RandyEvo]

Ok first off, reading the rules I end up in TTS with the Evo

3480 pds / 415 whp

That because I have an upgraded turbocharger

 

The GTI 2.8L is naturally aspirated, but I plan on making it turbo with around 300 whp to play around. Where Im going to end up? TTS same as the EVO or what? What will be my base class if I change it to turbo, now my base class is TTF.

 

Some input is well appreciated.

Thanks

 

It would depend on the minimum competition weight of the vehicle, and the actual fwhp. But, it would probably be near TTC** if the minimum competition weight was near the curb weight.

 

This will be based on what?

As stated in the rules all cars with a Upgraded or Added Turbocharger are sent directly to SUR and in SUR they will be classified based on the power to weight ratio, that from what I just finished reading the rules.

 

Let me know Greg, same thing happens with the EVO's, STI, and Eclipses with upgraded turbo's, we dont add points for the upgrade, we just (based on the rules) send the cars to SUR and then classified by the PtW ratio.

 

Thanks

[RandyEvo]

I have no weight reduction Warr, and Im 6'2" 215

If I did weight reduction I definately would be in TTU, but since this is my daily driver.

 

That's why I was surprised by your weight. Mine is my daily driver, and I have no weight reduction either, but at 6'2 225, my MR is 3367 with under 1/4 tank of gas. Do you have an SSL model? That's the only model heavier than the MR. Trying to figure out why yours is so heavy. Do you race with the spare tire, jack, and tools still in the trunk?

 

I have a GSR 2005 Warr

 

And I will tell you some reasons my car is heavier:

Stock manifold = 12 pounds aprox

My Turbotrix Manifold = 22 pounds

 

Stock turbo = 15 pounds or so

50trim turbo = 20+ pounds

 

No seats removed

Ultimate Racing IC Pipes = Stainless Steel (really heavy pipes)

Tial BOV = heavy as hell

Intake Pipe = Stainless Steel

Catback = Stainless Steel (NOT lightweight like yours)

 

Im more concerned in how the car looks, so the cops dont rape me if they see me at a stop light with the exhaust rumbling, because my exhaust looks almost identical to stock.

 

I do have Volk Wheels TE37 17x8.5, with Stoptech stock replacement rotors that actually are 1 pound over the stock ones. 255/40/17 are heavy tires, what else do you want to know about my car?

 

Also, my glove box has always a full box of spark plugs, the cigarrete tray is filled with change for the tolls and the only thing I remove to race is my floor mat, the spare tire and the jack. I still have my sound system with the Subwoofer in the trunk (stock position)

[warrtalon]

Just seems like a lot of extra weight. I'm sure my 18X9.5s with 285s are much heavier than your wheel/tire combo. My cat-back is definitely light, but the rest is all very similar. Your 3480 is with a near empty tank? I also didn't think we were allowed to have anything loose like that in the glove box. I take the glove box out and put it on the ground ever since I got reprimanded for having junk in there. Imagine flying spark plug projectiles, haha.

 

You mentioned a subwoofer there at the end. Does that mean you have an SSL GSR? If so, then that would explain everything. You haven't said it was an SSL GSR - just a GSR - so I wasn't sure. The SSL GSR is the heaviest by far and weighs 70lbs more than the base GSR in stock form.

Edited March 1, 2007 by Guest

[kbrew8991]

Ok first off, reading the rules I end up in TTS with the Evo

3480 pds / 415 whp

That because I have an upgraded turbocharger

 

The GTI 2.8L is naturally aspirated, but I plan on making it turbo with around 300 whp to play around. Where Im going to end up? TTS same as the EVO or what? What will be my base class if I change it to turbo, now my base class is TTF.

 

Some input is well appreciated.

Thanks

 

It would depend on the minimum competition weight of the vehicle, and the actual fwhp. But, it would probably be near TTC** if the minimum competition weight was near the curb weight.

 

This will be based on what?

As stated in the rules all cars with a Upgraded or Added Turbocharger are sent directly to SUR and in SUR they will be classified based on the power to weight ratio, that from what I just finished reading the rules.

 

Let me know Greg, same thing happens with the EVO's, STI, and Eclipses with upgraded turbo's, we dont add points for the upgrade, we just (based on the rules) send the cars to SUR and then classified by the PtW ratio.

 

Thanks

 

if you add a turbo or change a turbo on a lower classified car than A or B (or wherever those damn rally cars start out at) you might see your base class adjusted to something below SUR (say adding a Turbo to a TTH car or something....) But since you guys start out so high to begin with, you're better off not even bothering Greg for a re-class due to those changes and just doing the SUR math yourself because you're going to end up there anyway

[Greg G.]

Ken, you are correct for most of the STI's and Evo's (although I have re-classed a few that were pretty stock except for the aftermarket turbo mods, and still ended up in TTA). However, for Randy's 2.8L GTI, he should get it re-base classed to see where it ends up. Those cars are pretty heavy for FWD cars (like mine), and it may end up base classed in TTC** or TTB, etc.

 

"The GTI 2.8L is naturally aspirated, but I plan on making it turbo with around 300 whp to play around. Where Im going to end up? TTS same as the EVO or what? What will be my base class if I change it to turbo, now my base class is TTF."

 

Randy, I'm not sure what you are reading that is giving you the impression that all aftermarket turbo's get moved to "S,U,R", but you are not reading it correctly.

 

From the TT Rules, page 21:

 

3) Non-OEM turbo or supercharger, or upgraded or modified turbo/supercharger: engine swap rules apply—all OEM naturally aspirated vehicles that have been upgraded to forced induction and forced induction vehicles with an upgraded or modified turbo or supercharger must be evaluated by the National TT Director on an individual basis for new base classification based on chassis dynamometer testing and minimum competition weight as in 1) above and in Section 6.4.2 Dyno Testing Procedures. After re-classification, modification points will not be assessed for weight reduction or engine. However, if the power output of

the vehicle is increased, the participant will have to get the vehicle re-classified again.

[RandyEvo]

Just seems like a lot of extra weight. I'm sure my 18X9.5s with 285s are much heavier than your wheel/tire combo. My cat-back is definitely light, but the rest is all very similar. Your 3480 is with a near empty tank? I also didn't think we were allowed to have anything loose like that in the glove box. I take the glove box out and put it on the ground ever since I got reprimanded for having junk in there. Imagine flying spark plug projectiles, haha.

 

You mentioned a subwoofer there at the end. Does that mean you have an SSL GSR? If so, then that would explain everything. You haven't said it was an SSL GSR - just a GSR - so I wasn't sure. The SSL GSR is the heaviest by far and weighs 70lbs more than the base GSR in stock form.

 

Yep sorry, also exact weight now with the replacement RalliArt front strut bar (lighter than stock) and the AMS mini bat kit, 3456 is the new weight.

[RandyEvo]

So Greg, to take an Example, an Eclipse GSX with a 2.4l (stroker) and all the bolt-ons plus the upgraded turbocharger, doesnt go directly to SUR classification?

 

Thats a friend's car btw, but he doesnt post.

[Greg G.]

So Greg, to take an Example, an Eclipse GSX with a 2.4l (stroker) and all the bolt-ons plus the upgraded turbocharger, doesnt go directly to SUR classification?

 

Thats a friend's car btw, but he doesnt post.

 

That's right. It gets a new base classification. Now, if the thing puts out 500 awhp, and weighs 2900 lbs, then the base class will be above TTA, and it would "go directly" to SUR classing. And, anytime a car has an "adjusted wt/power ratio" (see Section 6.2 of the rules) of more than 8.7:1, it goes directly to TTU/TTR classing. So, depending on how much power the car now has, how much it weighs, what size and type of tires it has, and what you mean by "all the bolt-ons", the car could end up in any number of TT classes.