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Ford Racing's Boss 302S Ready to Race AI in 2011


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robbodleimages

which module are you using? C, S or GT500? I believe it was Dean Martin that posted here that using the FR500C module with Toyos was a fast way to square tires.

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Red Tornado

Wow what an exciting post to read after being gone for a few weeks. Yes I am one of those people who is building a max 2011 GT (boss clone) and will likely be near $70k when done. I bought it though knowing I am racing this car for at least 5-10 years so viewed it as a long term investment and a car that could run multiple classes and sanctioning bodies.

 

Some basic thoughts that will likely irritate some folks but just my personal thoughts so sorry:

- AI cars shouldn't be competitive for under $15k. That is what spec miata and e30 spec are for. Sorry but it's the reality folks and always has been. You can still have tons of fun so don't get me wrong but rules should be setup for new cars with factory support at this level if your gonna win it all. That's racing and always has been. And my 2004 Cobra was really competitive and I bought it for $26k so not only new cars can win. I still don't know if my new car will be quicker than my old. The rear in my old car had amazing grip where the new car has better turn in. Now if you could combine the two hell yes!!

- I love GM's and have owned dozens of firebirds and camaro's in my days. I have been willing to pay alot extra the past two race purchases even for a lesser product but in the end the mustangs I have bought were so much more compelling in so many ways (parts available, shops to work on them, cost, etc..).

- The AI diectors really listen and I think have balanced well the need to always grow with technology but balance with the grassroots basics of most cars. They have been fairly slow and very methodical with changes over the I guess now 7-8 years I have raced AI.

 

 

Personally the most fun over the past few years has been the big races with a whole bunch of cool guys and gals now. The AI and CMC bunch is a great group of racers. Why do you think so many of these other folks want to get in it.

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Dave,

Give me a call this week. You're starting to sound like a broken record.

I'd love to hear you out, discuss, explain or shed light as much as I can.

 

-=- Todd

 

Todd,

I would have to agree with Dave. Why wouldn't the Pratt Miller ABS set up be legal for the GM guys if the Ford Racing system on the FR500 Mustangs are AI Legal? Seems fair to me???

Why does the Mngment of AI lean to the Blue Oval side of things??? I thought we were tryin to create parity amongst the Big 3? Dave has some really good points. I know ABS in the right hands is an advantage. I don't use it because I have always raced with out it but if I built a 5th gen Camaro I'd use the Riley or Pratt Miller set up just like the Grand Am Camaro's..... Its seems only fair???

 

That's one of the reasons why I wanted to talk to Dave. We don't necessarily lean toward the Blue Oval, however, as you know a lot of our racers are in the Blue Oval camp, and bring years of experience & knowledge. Those that know me can tell you that I've been trying to get GM & Chrysler into AI for years, as well as the older cars. So the claims that we want this to be an S197 series are false.

 

If you guys have intel that suggests that Pratt & Miller has a comparable ABS unit or module for GM cars that is available to the public (similar to Ford Racing)...we'd consider that. Just haven't seen it to date.

 

Bottom line is this guys...

1) This thread is getting far off track, as it was supposed to be about the good news coming out of Detroit.

2) The direction of AI is to reel in costs by relying more heavily on factory OEM cars...which come with some of these modern technologies.

3) We are about ready to publish the 2011 rules and I will again provide a "State of the Union" address to coincide with the rules to explain the thinking behind them.

 

Talk to you soon and Happy Holidays!

-=- Todd

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It is a platform decision, Chevy guys get the LS motor, Ford guys get the ABS and Aero. Pick you weapon and deal with the disadvantages.

 

I chose another 4th gen for the simple fact that there are so many in my region that you could probably build a car from the spare parts they are carrying.

 

If I wanted the easy path to a national championship I would build a 2011 S197, it is the best car PERIOD! How could it not be? It has an almost 20yr factory development and support advantage!

 

Having said that Tommy gave those guys hell in a car that is a POS, I mean that in the fondest way! He gives us hope! He doesnt have ABS and his splitter is completely homemade, he might have a couple hundred in it! You could replace Tommy's car today for less than 20K EASY! Prolly 15K if you really watched it, It is suprisingly basic.

 

I personally believe ABS hurts driver development. The best drivers in the dry simply won't need it, the wet is different.

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sundialracing

I look at it another way...

 

Why punish Ford Racing?? Nothing is stopping the other OEM's from doing the same thing.

 

On another note, I just read in my latest Automotive News that Cadillac is back in World Challenge with the CTS-V coupe, maybe GM Performance is getting back in the game.....

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I look at it another way...

 

Why punish Ford Racing?? Nothing is stopping the other OEM's from doing the same thing.

 

On another note, I just read in my latest Automotive News that Cadillac is back in World Challenge with the CTS-V coupe, maybe GM Performance is getting back in the game.....

 

Uncle..........., read previous statements for responses.

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sundialracing
I look at it another way...

 

Why punish Ford Racing?? Nothing is stopping the other OEM's from doing the same thing.

 

On another note, I just read in my latest Automotive News that Cadillac is back in World Challenge with the CTS-V coupe, maybe GM Performance is getting back in the game.....

 

Uncle..........., read previous statements for responses.

 

10-4

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Attempting to clarify:

I'm really not attempting to rally the troups for my cause. You can agree or disagree with me or anyone else. I don't expect anything that is discussed here to change the direction. This isn't a democracy, but we do get to have opinions, which is nice.

So, from my point of view, there are those that think allowing just one platform the ability to readily bolt on a race developed ABS system, that it's of no value, doesn't really help a "really good" driver, and shouldn't matter. Maybe it doesn't in some drivers cases, but it certainly does in others. You are all kidding yourselves if you think a quality race ABS system can't make a huge difference with a skilled person. You're also kidding yourself if you think it only matters in the rain, or you simply don't understand those systems. The effects are magnified in the rain, but they are also there in the dry, especially over a stock production system. You are wrong if you think a race version is only there to prevent lock up. Thats what the stock production versions do. A race version is much better then that. Of course it doesn't mean if you have one, you're going to win. True, but, again used properly, it's a significant advantage.

So, these nearly worthless, highly developed race ABS systems really don't help, need to be made legal in AI because......? I have no idea why. That's the question I've asked since this started a few years ago. Why? The tranmission, I at least understand why, but I think it just makes a mockery of the whole rule system, when rules can be tweaked any time to fit a certain situation. You can't just make an eleventh hour mod because a certain car needs to be legal. Doesnt work that way. At least it shouldn't. And if no one else is fired up about any of this, then I guess it's just me, I must not be that good of a racer if I'm affriad of all this STUFF. However, I still think the flatforms should be as close to equal as posssible.

 

I don't see a good reason not to make any race ABS system available to everyone. That should be fair, shouldn't it?

 

x2. You saved me the keystrokes.

 

I am of the Jeff Feit belief that if you can't enforce it, either open it up or make it illegal. What check do we have to know the unit someone is using has factory programming? WE DON'T. You can argue the effectiveness of ABS and custom programming all day if you want but none of that matters if you can't enforce it.

 

 

"Camaros may use any GM produced ABS unit such as Corvette Z06 etc" Oh really? Just pop in a ABS unit from a junkyard Z06 and it should work great with an OEM vette calibration. Yea right. Or I can find a whiz at GM to custom program the unit for me cause - thats right - it can't be checked anyways.

 

Makes a lot of sense.

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  • 2 weeks later...

 

"Camaros may use any GM produced ABS unit such as Corvette Z06 etc" Oh really? Just pop in a ABS unit from a junkyard Z06 and it should work great with an OEM vette calibration. Yea right. Or I can find a whiz at GM to custom program the unit for me cause - thats right - it can't be checked anyways.

 

Makes a lot of sense.

 

 

Dont the new Camaros come with ABS?

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Dont the new Camaros come with ABS?

 

The new Camaros share about as much with older Camaros as they do with older Mustangs.

 

So, ina few years, we can expect a as manynew Camaro's as Mustangs. Self correcting problem

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So, ina few years, we can expect a as manynew Camaro's as Mustangs. Self correcting problem

Doubt it. From what I've seen of the few trying to get a new Camaro to go fast. It is taking A LOT of effort, time and money. For just a lot of money, you can jump in a turn key new Mustang and be competetive.

 

j

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