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Al F.

What is on the table so far for '09

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Tri-Agan
When this thread was started we were all moving to CMC2 rules, now we're not.

 

(You're right.....but back when this thread started....on October 4th.....we we weren't faced with a "redistribution of wealth" social policy either, but sometimes things just change for the worse and you have to pick yourself off the ground and move on. Maybe the new administration will force everyone to sell any racecar over $10,000 and stipulate that they buy a CMC car so that everyone is equal.

 

Just a gentle reminder Matt.....JJ & I love black flags.

 

Although you make good points.....let's wait as see what pans out with the rules.

 

By the way....good job this weekend, it was a really fun weekend. (If my car gets shrink-wrapped again in the future I know who will be getting a black flag in the next session.) (Where did the blow up sheep come from again.....that was really funny?)

 

Kent

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tacovini
Todd drives a Fox? Todd who?

I somewhat remember a driver named Todd a few years ago but I thought he was an urban legend.

 

What he said.

Since I've been a NASA member no one named Todd has race in CMC in Texas.

 

JJ

 

That's right, Jerry...I was racing CMC Fox Mustangs back when you hadn't heard what an "apex" was.

 

Kidding aside, Jerry, I do look forward to the day when we can race side by side, but the truth of the matter is that in the past 2 years that you've been racing in CMC I've only brought my Fox Mustang out a few times. However, the prior 10-11 years, I was fairly active with the old girl.

 

I've been in on all the Series Director discussions and have a Fox point of view. In addition, as Al mentioned, my car is in his garage for all the measurements & poking & prodding he needs to do to help us work thru this latest rules evolution.

 

So hang in there everyone and it'll all work out fine!

...and trust me...you don't want to see the 'vert on a Texas track again.

Oh yes, fear the Mustang Roadster!!!!

Buhwahahahaha!

 

-=- T

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liebbe1548534713
...and trust me...you don't want to see the 'vert on a Texas track again.

Oh yes, fear the Mustang Roadster!!!!

Buhwahahahaha!

 

-=- T

 

I'm afraid. I think it will be like a crack addict coming out of rehab and all his friends offer him a hit!!!! He's going to go freakin' nuts!!!!

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Rustang72
Just a gentle reminder Matt.....JJ & I love black flags.
...and we have more plastic wrap.

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Rustang72
16X8 for CMC, 17X9.5 for CMC2, that is the max size allowed.

CMC rules are done waiting for NASA release.

Thanks,

Tony Guaglione

What happened to 17x9 and 255/40-17 for CMC?
This never got answered. We will get 17" wheels and 255/40-17.... right?

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CMC#11

I think it will be the same as 2008, 17x9.5" max and a 275/40/17 max.

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Rustang72
I think it will be the same as 2008, 17x9.5" max and a 275/40/17 max.
That's for CMC2.

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Tony G

For 2009:

Same as 2008 was.

CMC2, the max is 17X9.5 and the max tire is 275/40/17.

CMC, max is 16X8 and max tire is 255/50/16.

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Rustang72

That makes absolutely no sense when they will eventually be merged into 1 class. Was the test car too fast or something?

 

How about flaring fenders on a Fox?

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bsim

Why doesn't that make sense?

 

For them to merge into one, they have to be different today, don't they?

 

16" wheels were stock on the earlier cars, 17" on the later. There's no reason to force all the CMC cars to move to 17" (you KNOW everyone would do it), nor to force CMC2 cars to buy all new wheels and force new brake packages to fit under the 16s.

 

(sigh)

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mitchntx1548534714
That makes absolutely no sense when they will eventually be merged into 1 class. Was the test car too fast or something?

 

How about flaring fenders on a Fox?

 

Speaking from experience ... You really aren't making any head way or friends. This group is more about friends than competitors.

 

I would imagine that WHEN the 2 classes are merged, THEN allowances will be made to make BOTH wheels work AS CLOSE TO THE SAME AS POSSIBLE. No one knows what that will be till more folks test back to back.

 

Till then ...

 

"It is what it is."

Adam Ginsberg circa 2005

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Rustang72
Why doesn't that make sense?

 

For them to merge into one, they have to be different today, don't they?

 

16" wheels were stock on the earlier cars, 17" on the later. There's no reason to force all the CMC cars to move to 17" (you KNOW everyone would do it), nor to force CMC2 cars to buy all new wheels and force new brake packages to fit under the 16s.

 

(sigh)

If you restrict tire width to 255 for CMC, it's a simple change to move to CMC2 when the time comes. If you restrict CMC to 16", the change in class would be new tires AND new wheels.

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KiMifan

I was hoping that CMC would adopt 17s as an incremental step toward a future merger with CMC-2. Kind of a halfway step so that when the merger happens, some of the upgrades are already in place and it's not so much of a jump to make to move up. I guess not.

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bsim

Change wheels now, or change 'em later, same result.

 

I can't believe guys are complaining that they get to keep what they have now and NOT spend any $$.

 

(sigh)

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KiMifan

Some of us are new and hoping to buy wheels and other parts once. If you know you are eventually going to change things, why wait and have people buy parts this year and then buy more parts when the rules change in a couple of years? If you didn't know what the change was going to be, that might make sense, but if you know what the changes are going to be, and you actually have a timeline, then it's pretty unfair to not implement some of it right now. If it's inevitable that everyone will be making these changes just get it over with. If it's not mandatory, then nobody is really forced to do it anyway, but it might save a lot of people money now.

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Tri-Agan
Some of us are new and hoping to buy wheels and other parts once. If you know you are eventually going to change things, why wait and have people buy parts this year and then buy more parts when the rules change in a couple of years? If you didn't know what the change was going to be, that might make sense, but if you know what the changes are going to be, and you actually have a timeline, then it's pretty unfair to not implement some of it right now. If it's inevitable that everyone will be making these changes just get it over with. If it's not mandatory, then nobody is really forced to do it anyway, but it might save a lot of people money now.

 

You and Matt make great points. Right or wrong, the issue I see is that there is a contingent of drivers that think CMC will stay around forever if you leave the current rules. I have a simple difference of opinion. The vast majority of CMC cars are getting close to 20 years old, and history shows that race series' will not last forever without slight evolutions. What I see is that most new drivers that start in NASA who drive an SN-95 Mustang or 4th gen Camaro would rather race in CMC2 than in CMC. I also think that many would opt to start in CMC rather than CMC2 if there was a 17 inch wheel rule. For many SN-95 drivers, they can step right into CMC and work on the upgrades necessary for CMC2 as they gain experience. By limiting the CMC class to 16's rather than opening it up to 17's or both, I think it helps push new drivers up to CMC2. Let's face it, most of the cars out there on the street that people look to buy in order to make into a race car already have bigger wheels. Who in their right mind will buy 16's just to dumb their car down to a series that is just past it's peak.

 

I love both race series. I think there is currently a place for both. I also know that drivers want to race against a lot of other cars. In this region I see one class growing faster than the other, and that class is CMC2.

 

kent

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cmc35
I can't believe guys are complaining that they get to keep what they have now and NOT spend any $$.

 

(sigh)

 

Ditto, plus...

 

(1) a "set" merge date for CMC and CMC2 no longer exists.

(2) no, it's not "pretty unfair to not implement (things) right now." CMC is still alive and well, and as such, will be governed by the same basic set of rules that has served it well for these many years. CMC2 is a different class.

 

Pick a class, build your car to that class, and come out and race. If the two classes ever merge, established racers will carry a lot more weight in terms of how to handle such a merge.

 

-chris

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mitchntx1548534714
Some of us are new and hoping to buy wheels and other parts once. If you know you are eventually going to change things, why wait and have people buy parts this year and then buy more parts when the rules change in a couple of years? If you didn't know what the change was going to be, that might make sense, but if you know what the changes are going to be, and you actually have a timeline, then it's pretty unfair to not implement some of it right now. If it's inevitable that everyone will be making these changes just get it over with. If it's not mandatory, then nobody is really forced to do it anyway, but it might save a lot of people money now.

 

What I'm coming to realize is that this is more than personal or even regional. It's national.

 

What would be great for me TODAY, might in effect hurt 10 of your peers scattered through out other regions.

 

I know and understand you are wanting to only buy wheels once. If that's the case, I suggest you buy 17s and run CMC2 today. If you want to run CMC, then buy 16s. 16s will be perfectly acceptable in CMC2.

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Glenn

if i had to buy wheels, i would buy 17's and run CMC-2.

its that simple. otherwise do like i did - pick up OEM crap till you have 4 complete sets (and yes, i need that many sets) and only be invested in them for about $100. how? buy wheels w/ tires on them and sell the tires.

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KiMifan

All I'm saying is that if you know everybody is eventually going to run on 17s in 1, 2 or 3 years anyway, why not just change that rule now? If the 16 stays legal, the people who don't change now probably won't change then either. What's the difference?

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Glenn

17's will NEVER be legal in CMC period. but 16's will be legal in CMC-2 and that is a fact. if at some point 17's prove to be faster, then some type of penalty will be assesed for running 17's vs 16's.

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cmc35
All I'm saying is that if you know everybody is eventually going to run on 17s in 1, 2 or 3 years anyway, why not just change that rule now? If the 16 stays legal, the people who don't change now probably won't change then either. What's the difference?

 

For whatever reason, you have chosen not to read/understand the gentle hints given above.

 

(sigh)

 

-chris

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Glenn

and your free to change your wheels now, just move the CMC-2 and your all good.

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GT4Point6

There are CMC cars on 16's faster than unrestricted CMC2 cars on 17's.

 

The 17's with tires weigh more than 16's with tire that is worth something not to mention some CMC/CMC2 cars regulary pass AI cars... YREMV

 

Run your 16's (and you probably got them if you have ever ran CMC) or take Glenn's advise.

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mitchntx1548534714
All I'm saying is that if you know everybody is eventually going to run on 17s in 1, 2 or 3 years anyway, why not just change that rule now? If the 16 stays legal, the people who don't change now probably won't change then either. What's the difference?

 

You can either take the advice of many and just go racing

 

or

 

you can wait for the rules to catch up with your rationalization.

 

Here, take a sip of Kool-aid ...

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